And that creates a vicious cycle because those players do nothing to lift us up. It needs to be broken even if it causes some pain or is a big risk. If we spend an average of 75k on 17 players it leaves 1.6m in the cap floor for 5 quality foreigners (average 320k each). But maybe that's not realistic, im not sure. What about an average of 90k each for 17 locals? Surely that is doable? That gives 1.35m to spend on 5 quality foreigners (average 270k each). The real figure might land somewhere in the middle. I think we need at least 2.2m in well spend funds tied up in our starting XI and preferred subs.
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Mariners Squad - 2019-2020
- Thread starter pjennings
- Start date
And that creates a vicious cycle because those players do nothing to lift us up. It needs to be broken even if it causes some pain or is a big risk. If we spend an average of 75k on 17 players it leaves 1.6m in the cap floor for 5 quality foreigners (average 320k each). But maybe that's not realistic, im not sure. What about an average of 90k each for 17 locals? Surely that is doable? That gives 1.35m to spend on 5 quality foreigners (average 270k each). The real figure might land somewhere in the middle. I think we need at least 2.2m in well spend funds tied up in our starting XI and preferred subs.
FFC Mariner
Well-Known Member
If he is upset about bejng vilified he can always say he is open to offers and just go.
He has killed this club and has no one to blame but himself
Erin_Mariner
Member
I agree. But I think the blame is for his failure to find a way to get other investors for over 5 years and/or find a way to get the Council, CCF and the community working with him constructively on this. I don’t blame him for not having enough coin to pay more
He is open to offers and has said so. Has he not?
pjennings
Well-Known Member
You would think that if the club gets the stadium rights and can exploit some 365 days a year retail opportunities that investors might be easier to find. We can only hope.
Forum Phoenix
Well-Known Member
Thanks for that addition Erin.
This needs to be understood.
Vilified is the right world. Sure it’s not atypical behaviour for football fans to blame an owner, and things have been miserable for fans. But as far as I can tell, the guy deserves better.
Erin_Mariner
Member
You would think that if the rights deal is good enough and they manage it well enough they can reduce the overall cost to them and reduce the overall losses. It’s those 1-2mil a year losses for an uncompetitive club in a capped league that is surely the biggest turn off for investors.
Forum Phoenix
Well-Known Member
He’s stated he’s open to offers?
I’m a big fan of your gallows humour FFC, but reasoning with you on some things, is like trying to get a Sith Lord over to the ‘bright side’.
Ironbark
Well-Known Member
It's an emotional sport. The Central Coast had a club to be truly proud of - punching above it's weight through heart and grit, and having a massive community presence.
These last 5 years - most were willing to ride out 2, even 3 years of spoons or near spoons to build sustainability. That's hard for fans to accept but on the whole everyone knew it was in the best interests of the club and took it on the chin.
But nearly 6 years in and we're losing 6-2 in embarrassing fashion, 7 losses in a row, 14 losses out 19 games, 1 clean sheet in close to 50 games, and are pretty much certain for a 4th spoon in 6 years. There is a limit to the pain, embarrassment and disappointment fans are willing to endure...and endurance suffers when there is no end in sight.
When the wound stays painfully open for too long people just want it to end. So we start casting around to blame, to find the causes and put an end to them.
Unfortunately without full knowledge of all the factors blame gets cast around in the most likely directions whether they are correct or not. Due to the pain it gets acerbic. Not always accurately or fairly.
The problems are convoluted, accumulative and difficult to untangle and fix. I think most would have been perfectly happy with some reasonable progress this season in lieu of success. It seemed like it was that way for a little while. Now it is back to 'Have we hit bottom yet' territory. So the sting is very much back and people need/ed to vent - including me.
Whilst I can't believe I am saying this AGAIN - we do have to take a deep breath and look to next year. Staj should be able to build stronger squad in conjunction with Anton and a TD and set a system in place with a targeted starting 11 rather than working with the Frankenstein's monster of a team we have. Sometimes our monster is inhumanly strong and gets success in games, but more often than not it is shambolic and falls apart.
If we Frankenstein next season that's probably it. But there is that shimmer of hope and I think a united front now needs to be the only forward.
So I'm going to thank MC for his personal investment into our club and the losses he has taken on our behalf. He has lost more money to this club than anyone else on the planet and I'm sure MC is at least as much stinging from results as we are.
The club hasn't communicated it's plans to resurrect next season as yet and may not be able to as you can't talk about signings before they are locked down etc. But during the off season I hope they communicate a little more openly about strategy because it'll all be easier if they include us in the journey so we can all pull in the same direction rather than bickering and blaming being thrown around without regard to knowledge.
I'm hurting and angry. But I will back us into next season and throw my weight and support into a united front to pull us out of the quicksand. The more of us that do the more likely we are to succeed. Let's think about a time ahead when we look back to these dark ages as something that happened, and that we learned from to become stronger and better.
These last 5 years - most were willing to ride out 2, even 3 years of spoons or near spoons to build sustainability. That's hard for fans to accept but on the whole everyone knew it was in the best interests of the club and took it on the chin.
But nearly 6 years in and we're losing 6-2 in embarrassing fashion, 7 losses in a row, 14 losses out 19 games, 1 clean sheet in close to 50 games, and are pretty much certain for a 4th spoon in 6 years. There is a limit to the pain, embarrassment and disappointment fans are willing to endure...and endurance suffers when there is no end in sight.
When the wound stays painfully open for too long people just want it to end. So we start casting around to blame, to find the causes and put an end to them.
Unfortunately without full knowledge of all the factors blame gets cast around in the most likely directions whether they are correct or not. Due to the pain it gets acerbic. Not always accurately or fairly.
The problems are convoluted, accumulative and difficult to untangle and fix. I think most would have been perfectly happy with some reasonable progress this season in lieu of success. It seemed like it was that way for a little while. Now it is back to 'Have we hit bottom yet' territory. So the sting is very much back and people need/ed to vent - including me.
Whilst I can't believe I am saying this AGAIN - we do have to take a deep breath and look to next year. Staj should be able to build stronger squad in conjunction with Anton and a TD and set a system in place with a targeted starting 11 rather than working with the Frankenstein's monster of a team we have. Sometimes our monster is inhumanly strong and gets success in games, but more often than not it is shambolic and falls apart.
If we Frankenstein next season that's probably it. But there is that shimmer of hope and I think a united front now needs to be the only forward.
So I'm going to thank MC for his personal investment into our club and the losses he has taken on our behalf. He has lost more money to this club than anyone else on the planet and I'm sure MC is at least as much stinging from results as we are.
The club hasn't communicated it's plans to resurrect next season as yet and may not be able to as you can't talk about signings before they are locked down etc. But during the off season I hope they communicate a little more openly about strategy because it'll all be easier if they include us in the journey so we can all pull in the same direction rather than bickering and blaming being thrown around without regard to knowledge.
I'm hurting and angry. But I will back us into next season and throw my weight and support into a united front to pull us out of the quicksand. The more of us that do the more likely we are to succeed. Let's think about a time ahead when we look back to these dark ages as something that happened, and that we learned from to become stronger and better.
Ironbark
Well-Known Member
I left this stuff out of my last post because it is speculative - but an independent league, changes to caps etc. - it all provides hope of greater investment in the club. Combined with a targeted approached to recruitment with a quality coach, Anton and TD and we should turn a corner next season
pjennings
Well-Known Member
Yes - but that is only part of it. If the losses disappear and the precinct becomes vibrant all year round then investment in the club that owns the precinct can complement investment that is also being made in the surrounding area.
Forum Phoenix
Well-Known Member
I also don’t understand why people have bought into the failure to get other investors position that I’ve now heard many times. Again, it’s incorrect framing.
We are not, and have never been, an investment opportunity. Especially when MC took over. We are a sink hole that only a very wealthy philanthropist could consider. And to be honest, there are a great many more worthwhile causes that philanthropists can spend money on than our regional football club. Which is why I’ve always been grateful we actually found one who would.
If he was wealthier, that’d be better. No arguments. But now while he’s losing his money, he’s also in trouble for not being able to persuade other philanthropists to lose their money alongside him. I mean who wouldn’t want to come, lose money and get vilified by our supporter base. Quite the opportunity.
We are the least viable and least attractive club in the league. If we can ever become sustainable it will be a major achievement. And from what I can tell, that’s what a bunch of decent people have been working hard to achieve. And unlike the accusations I see levelled, there’s a lot of evidence to support this position. Seems clear that it’s a tough gig, and they just haven’t been able to pull it off so are getting crucified because it is genuinely shit to be a mariners fan. But even then, they’re ignoring all the vitriol and still trying.
Be nice if people could understand there is a universe where it sucks to be a Mariners fan, and the owner and management can also still be good people. And all the evidence is on this side of the ledger. But yet all vitriol is on the other.
We are not, and have never been, an investment opportunity. Especially when MC took over. We are a sink hole that only a very wealthy philanthropist could consider. And to be honest, there are a great many more worthwhile causes that philanthropists can spend money on than our regional football club. Which is why I’ve always been grateful we actually found one who would.
If he was wealthier, that’d be better. No arguments. But now while he’s losing his money, he’s also in trouble for not being able to persuade other philanthropists to lose their money alongside him. I mean who wouldn’t want to come, lose money and get vilified by our supporter base. Quite the opportunity.
We are the least viable and least attractive club in the league. If we can ever become sustainable it will be a major achievement. And from what I can tell, that’s what a bunch of decent people have been working hard to achieve. And unlike the accusations I see levelled, there’s a lot of evidence to support this position. Seems clear that it’s a tough gig, and they just haven’t been able to pull it off so are getting crucified because it is genuinely shit to be a mariners fan. But even then, they’re ignoring all the vitriol and still trying.
Be nice if people could understand there is a universe where it sucks to be a Mariners fan, and the owner and management can also still be good people. And all the evidence is on this side of the ledger. But yet all vitriol is on the other.
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Forum Phoenix
Well-Known Member
Terrific post.
Is it really the golden egg, I guess hindsight if it happens will dispel this myth. I still think it’s clutching at not many straws.
geoffgfletch
Member
Since MC its well documented that we spend the cap floor. The problem is we are spending floor on utter shite. We need to inflate salaries to attract an average squad player. Throwing extra cash at players to come here isn't working. If we are not going to spend the cap the only way for us to get out of this hole is offer bonuses/incentives/challenges to players to get them here using the rest of the cap. Say to a striker "look mate we can only offer you x however every goal you score is a 10k bonus". Same for a GK, 10k per clean sheet. Make these guys earn there keep. We need to stop handing out over inflated salaries to rather average footballers.
Pirate Pete
Well-Known Member
I'm not really very happy with giving strikers or any player a bonus for scoring.
They get greedy. Won't pass.
Kid in my son's team was on $5 a goal. Greedy little f**ker wasn't a team player.
But team bonuses would be OK. Not sure how that would work under the cap though.
FFC Mariner
Well-Known Member
90% of the cap including scholarships (which dont have to be counted in the cap) @Shaun Mielekamp and Anton (Mr Improvement to you) not being on the same page during the recent pod was telling but he isnt anywhere near the cap floor
Capn Gus Bloodbeard
Well-Known Member
Imagine how few points we'd have if we didn't have Biraz this season.
That's a real downer and it makes another key position we need to recruit for - and it won't be a cheap one either.
That's a real downer and it makes another key position we need to recruit for - and it won't be a cheap one either.
FFC Mariner
Well-Known Member
So when Staj told Fox there were 10 spots to fill we could only think of 9...............now we know. We guessed at:
Judas
Jair
Melling
Shabow
Oar
Simon
Milan
Kim
Fox
Birra
Judas
Jair
Melling
Shabow
Oar
Simon
Milan
Kim
Fox
Birra
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