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Final Series- Local League Thread
- Thread starter Kareem
- Start date
oi
Kind of crazy topic
Congrats to all the GF winners
On the Kareem Saga I have a few opinions, tell me to get stuffed if you want but with exception of Keeper_Herbs it's kind of crazy;
Kareem- like you said it has happened before and probably will happen again! It sucked and sure their are corrupt ref's out there and its only a bad few that give a bad name for the rest of 'em. A ref definately shouldnt laugh you off but maybe time to let it go. You are entitled enough to vent your problem and I mean for weeks after HAL final we all we were whinghing eh?
Gus- Let Kareem think what he thinks, whats the problem with that? Insulting aint going to fix the problem? If anythign you have made it go on much longer than needed!
Oh and BTW you dont think all ref's are honest, fair people?
Keeper_Herbs- peacemaker. The only one on here not killing everyone. Not making things worse.
Priopeter & Kane Willow- dunno why on earth you guys got involved
Chill out every1
Peace out
Kind of crazy topic
Congrats to all the GF winners
On the Kareem Saga I have a few opinions, tell me to get stuffed if you want but with exception of Keeper_Herbs it's kind of crazy;
Kareem- like you said it has happened before and probably will happen again! It sucked and sure their are corrupt ref's out there and its only a bad few that give a bad name for the rest of 'em. A ref definately shouldnt laugh you off but maybe time to let it go. You are entitled enough to vent your problem and I mean for weeks after HAL final we all we were whinghing eh?
Gus- Let Kareem think what he thinks, whats the problem with that? Insulting aint going to fix the problem? If anythign you have made it go on much longer than needed!
Oh and BTW you dont think all ref's are honest, fair people?
Keeper_Herbs- peacemaker. The only one on here not killing everyone. Not making things worse.
Priopeter & Kane Willow- dunno why on earth you guys got involved
Chill out every1
Peace out
priorpeter
Well-Known Member
tikky said:
tikki - i got involved because it's a forum, and i'm entitled to put my 2 cents in. why on earth did you get involved?
Sym
Well-Known Member
It's a part of life
many refs are good
whereas some are bias or let their own emotions get in the way
or some are just plain s--t
but you can't have a game without them so cop it on the chin and move on with life
all in all, they are 13, just have fun while you are that age.
many refs are good
whereas some are bias or let their own emotions get in the way
or some are just plain s--t
but you can't have a game without them so cop it on the chin and move on with life
all in all, they are 13, just have fun while you are that age.
priorpeter
Well-Known Member
Sym said:
Amen.
[/bitching].
Capn Gus Bloodbeard
Well-Known Member
tikky - you honestly don't think there's a problem with a local - particularly a youth coach - coming on here and publicly abusing a local referee?
Sure, we've had a few people come on here with a bit of a complaint about some refereeing, little bit of a rant, but none of it has been anywhere near as severe as Kareem's tirade.
I certainly haven't tried to defend all of it, though I have, from time to time, suggested possible explanations. Referees aren't perfect. Neither are players. Nor coaches. Not while there's still human beings involved.
(Anyway, why would I tell you to get stuffed?)
Personally I find it quite frustrating when somebody who's had the experience in the middle can't even apply that when they're off the field to remember that 1) sometimes referees make mistakes (it isn't as easy as it looks from the dugout), and 2)More often the referee has a legitimate reason for making a decision which may not be abundantly clear from the dugouts. I'm sure Kareem has copped enough crap from people who aren't aware of that fact - yet he IS aware of those facts through his experience, yet chooses to forget that and put the same ignorant crap on the others. The fact that he fails to see that he's done anything wrong is just the icing on the cake.
I do find it quite disappointing that it's an ex-referee who's made the most scathing attack on a referee - and ultimately it's the exact same rubbish we hear day in, day out.
So why do you think the referees laugh it off when people come up to them and have a go at them after the game? Partly it's because it's a way of getting back at people when you can't really say anything to them. Considering how cut up kareem was about it I'd say it worked perfectly! What, we're all supposed to stand there and smile politely while we cop people having a go at us after the game? Not likely.
Instead of saying that the ref definitely shouldn't laugh it off, why don't you also point out that kareem definitely shouldn't have had a go at the ref after the game? Perhaps laughing it off is a somewhat antagonistic response, but cop as much crap as these people do and you may understand why some feel the need to get their own back a little, even if it's half hoping the guy having a go at us is going to get a bit more offended because we didn't get offended.
You have to admit though, laughing it off is a much better response than saying what's really on our mind.
(PS I haven't bothered answering your question directed at me, I think my post is long enough, but ask me again if you want a response)
As I said to Kareem, it isn't so much my intent to insult him as it is a hope that he realises what character traits he's portraying to others. It's his choice if he ignores it and continues on the path he's headed or if he actually stops and has a think about what he has to say.
If anybody thinks that the comments I made are unjustified and cross the line in themselves, then fair enough - that's something I can take in consideration and reflection.
Until I get what experience? My 14 year's playing experience? My 9 year's refereeing experience, my 2 year's coaching experience or my 5 year's experience as a referees coach/assessor/inspector/mentor?
Sorry, I'm not entirely clear - exactly which perspective am I not likely to see here?
Nice try Kareem, I await your next pearls of wisdom
Sure, we've had a few people come on here with a bit of a complaint about some refereeing, little bit of a rant, but none of it has been anywhere near as severe as Kareem's tirade.
I certainly haven't tried to defend all of it, though I have, from time to time, suggested possible explanations. Referees aren't perfect. Neither are players. Nor coaches. Not while there's still human beings involved.
(Anyway, why would I tell you to get stuffed?)
Personally I find it quite frustrating when somebody who's had the experience in the middle can't even apply that when they're off the field to remember that 1) sometimes referees make mistakes (it isn't as easy as it looks from the dugout), and 2)More often the referee has a legitimate reason for making a decision which may not be abundantly clear from the dugouts. I'm sure Kareem has copped enough crap from people who aren't aware of that fact - yet he IS aware of those facts through his experience, yet chooses to forget that and put the same ignorant crap on the others. The fact that he fails to see that he's done anything wrong is just the icing on the cake.
I do find it quite disappointing that it's an ex-referee who's made the most scathing attack on a referee - and ultimately it's the exact same rubbish we hear day in, day out.
So why do you think the referees laugh it off when people come up to them and have a go at them after the game? Partly it's because it's a way of getting back at people when you can't really say anything to them. Considering how cut up kareem was about it I'd say it worked perfectly! What, we're all supposed to stand there and smile politely while we cop people having a go at us after the game? Not likely.
Instead of saying that the ref definitely shouldn't laugh it off, why don't you also point out that kareem definitely shouldn't have had a go at the ref after the game? Perhaps laughing it off is a somewhat antagonistic response, but cop as much crap as these people do and you may understand why some feel the need to get their own back a little, even if it's half hoping the guy having a go at us is going to get a bit more offended because we didn't get offended.
You have to admit though, laughing it off is a much better response than saying what's really on our mind.
(PS I haven't bothered answering your question directed at me, I think my post is long enough, but ask me again if you want a response)
As I said to Kareem, it isn't so much my intent to insult him as it is a hope that he realises what character traits he's portraying to others. It's his choice if he ignores it and continues on the path he's headed or if he actually stops and has a think about what he has to say.
If anybody thinks that the comments I made are unjustified and cross the line in themselves, then fair enough - that's something I can take in consideration and reflection.
Kareem said:
Until I get what experience? My 14 year's playing experience? My 9 year's refereeing experience, my 2 year's coaching experience or my 5 year's experience as a referees coach/assessor/inspector/mentor?
Sorry, I'm not entirely clear - exactly which perspective am I not likely to see here?
Nice try Kareem, I await your next pearls of wisdom
How many 1-0 GF's u lost? A penalty. Even it is rare if you asked random people.Capn Gus Bloodbeard said:Kareem said:
Until I get what experience? My 14 year's playing experience? My 9 year's refereeing experience, my 2 year's coaching experience or my 5 year's experience as a referees coach/assessor/inspector/mentor?
Sorry, I'm not entirely clear - exactly which perspective am I not likely to see here?
Nice try Kareem, I await your next pearls of wisdom
As a player I am yet to suffer to such an extent, sure contraversial decisions (who hasnt) but not GF changing ones.
Whether it is possible that the ref made the right call it remains always that he made a game changing call.
Capn Gus Bloodbeard
Well-Known Member
GASP! Let's shoot him for making a possibly correct match-changing call!!!
You do of course realise that referees HAVE to make controversial decisions that change the course of the match, simply because those are the events that present themselves?
On Saturday I reffed a final. The result? 1-0. The goal came from a penalty.
And from the sound of the uproar, I bet not a lot of the losing team would have agreed with the penalty - however that's one penalty that I have absolutely no doubt that I got correct. It just so happens that it wasn't a massive foul, just a bit of a careless one - and from some angles it probably looked like there was no contact at all.
And no, it wasn't a 13C match ;-)
I wouldn't have a clue how many games I've had hinge on referee decisions. Nor how important they were.
I'm sure my team has also benefitted from a number of questionable decisions. As has yours - they may not stand out as much as a penalty, but even a midfield free kick can be just as significant as a penalty, if everything falls into place.
Important matches will be significantly affected by referees, fact.
Referees are human, and they WILL, from time to time, make mistakes.
Referees have a greatly different view from the coach in the dugouts - as you should know. As you should also know, the vast majority of the time the referee will have a BETTER view, which is why he may be able to spot a penalty that no spectators can see.
Sometimes the referee will have a poorer view. Angles can be deceptive, and all it takes is a player to run in the referee's line of sight at the wrong moment, and suddenly a referee in the best position he could be is completely unsighted.
One of those 3 things happened - and all of which will invariably be frustrating and confusing. That doesn't justify abusing and bagging out officials.
You also need to consider your responsibilities as a youth coach - they go far beyond simply teaching the players how to win games.
Yes, I've had to bite my tongue on the sideline a number of times, but I've remembered by thoughts in the middle when youth coaches have set appalling examples for their team, and that was sufficient.
Anyway, I gotta leave to catch a plane in less than an hour and I'm yet to pack.
Peace out, y'all. Good luck for the weekend.
You do of course realise that referees HAVE to make controversial decisions that change the course of the match, simply because those are the events that present themselves?
On Saturday I reffed a final. The result? 1-0. The goal came from a penalty.
And from the sound of the uproar, I bet not a lot of the losing team would have agreed with the penalty - however that's one penalty that I have absolutely no doubt that I got correct. It just so happens that it wasn't a massive foul, just a bit of a careless one - and from some angles it probably looked like there was no contact at all.
And no, it wasn't a 13C match ;-)
I wouldn't have a clue how many games I've had hinge on referee decisions. Nor how important they were.
I'm sure my team has also benefitted from a number of questionable decisions. As has yours - they may not stand out as much as a penalty, but even a midfield free kick can be just as significant as a penalty, if everything falls into place.
Important matches will be significantly affected by referees, fact.
Referees are human, and they WILL, from time to time, make mistakes.
Referees have a greatly different view from the coach in the dugouts - as you should know. As you should also know, the vast majority of the time the referee will have a BETTER view, which is why he may be able to spot a penalty that no spectators can see.
Sometimes the referee will have a poorer view. Angles can be deceptive, and all it takes is a player to run in the referee's line of sight at the wrong moment, and suddenly a referee in the best position he could be is completely unsighted.
One of those 3 things happened - and all of which will invariably be frustrating and confusing. That doesn't justify abusing and bagging out officials.
You also need to consider your responsibilities as a youth coach - they go far beyond simply teaching the players how to win games.
Yes, I've had to bite my tongue on the sideline a number of times, but I've remembered by thoughts in the middle when youth coaches have set appalling examples for their team, and that was sufficient.
Anyway, I gotta leave to catch a plane in less than an hour and I'm yet to pack.
Peace out, y'all. Good luck for the weekend.
Is it abuse or just bemoaning the ref?Capn Gus Bloodbeard said:
When you referred to abuse I thought I missed something. Maybe a difference in our opinions but abuse for me is calling him something etc.
Kareem Said
Seems to be bagging out the performance sure, but I personally dont see it as abuseKareem said:
0-1 against Toukley- u13C's
went down to a 29th min penalty
absolute schoker by ref- couldnt call fouls and his performance was just bad
couldnt manage time wasting
couldnt manage fouls to break up attack. twice they did this
it is a yellow card offence if it breaks up attack- player got past the guy and they trip him- breaking up attack.
And to answer your question, I will expand on Ted's comment
If a ref is in poor form you just can't take away a person's right to complain. Yes, no one should abuse him calling him a ***** etc.Ted said:
He was hurt and I think that good intentions or not (which they seem), your post made it bigger than it was. He vented and I doubt he would have said any more on the matter.
Take it or leave it, just thought I would put my 2 cents in on the matter refraining from abusing anyone including Kareem as tempting as most of you find it
(apart from Herbs and Ted).
Capn Gus Bloodbeard
Well-Known Member
tikky - obviously there is a problem of how exactly to handle underperforming referees. I don't know of any solution that will satisfy everybody
However, I can't encourage the notion that 'if you stuff up, you should cop it' (well, ok, slightly exaggerated from what you're saying) - because these notions only serve to drive the good referees out of the game. I hear what you're saying though.
As for when it degenerated from bagging out to abuse, have a look at kareem's last post on page 2.
still, good on you for keeping the peace. ;-)
Urgh, why am I still on here?? ok, I'm really going this time
However, I can't encourage the notion that 'if you stuff up, you should cop it' (well, ok, slightly exaggerated from what you're saying) - because these notions only serve to drive the good referees out of the game. I hear what you're saying though.
As for when it degenerated from bagging out to abuse, have a look at kareem's last post on page 2.
still, good on you for keeping the peace. ;-)
Urgh, why am I still on here?? ok, I'm really going this time
offtheball
Well-Known Member
Blaming referees seems to be a societal problem, no one wants to accept responsibility any more. It is always someone else's fault.
A pity neither of the losses Kareem was involved in on the weekend were because the other team played better.
Herbs seems to have hit the nail on the head, if you play well enough you take luck out of the equation. The old adage "The harder I work the luckier I get."
As for bemoaning the ref's pass mark, i'm sure most refs would admit the knowledge they gained in the lecture theatre and demonstrated in their exam paled into insignificance when compared to what they learnt in their first season of reffing. Don't forget refs start off officiating in under 8 or 9 non comp games where they learn on the job. I'm sure the refs association would agree that you are not really a ref until you have done this apprenticeship.
Kareem it is a pity you have given the job away after getting over the most difficult hurdle, that first season, all for a petulant dummy spit.
A pity neither of the losses Kareem was involved in on the weekend were because the other team played better.
Herbs seems to have hit the nail on the head, if you play well enough you take luck out of the equation. The old adage "The harder I work the luckier I get."
As for bemoaning the ref's pass mark, i'm sure most refs would admit the knowledge they gained in the lecture theatre and demonstrated in their exam paled into insignificance when compared to what they learnt in their first season of reffing. Don't forget refs start off officiating in under 8 or 9 non comp games where they learn on the job. I'm sure the refs association would agree that you are not really a ref until you have done this apprenticeship.
Kareem it is a pity you have given the job away after getting over the most difficult hurdle, that first season, all for a petulant dummy spit.
T
Well-Known Member
If you want to complain about the standard of refereeing, watch a WAA5 match!!!
I have seen some woeful refs in 1st division mens aswell.
And anyone who knows me, I'm not one to keep my mouth shut about poor reffing, but at the same time i will only blame a ref, when they consistantly fail to pick up the same thing repeatedly.
I have seen some woeful refs in 1st division mens aswell.
And anyone who knows me, I'm not one to keep my mouth shut about poor reffing, but at the same time i will only blame a ref, when they consistantly fail to pick up the same thing repeatedly.
Friday night was easily just that. 3-0offtheball said:
Doyalson ran through us.
They had 1 great set piece. (actually more than 1 but 1 that they scored from).
We were off par and it showed, I only said ref didnt help. But even we had the best ref in the world, we would have lost- no doubt!
I only wish we had a more experienced ref on saturday but hey its in the past
Not a dummy spit IMO.offtheball said:
And like said before one of several reasons. Realistically icing on the cake!
And you know what I thought to myself maybe I should just keep reffing- it is good money but I thought...
No, it isnt right- I need the passion, I need reffing to mean something otherwise maybe I wont ref the best that I can!
And on the passmark, how many ref's end up relearning the lawbook.
I had a friend reffing. Someone who is still my friend.
I wont say who but essentially he made a mistake.
Opposing team said somethign bad during play- ref straight away blew whistle and gave a yellow card.
The ref then restarted play not by an indirect freekcik (which it is if I am not mistaken) but a by a dropball?
I tried to tell my friend this and he gave a yellow card straight away? My only card for dissent. When most ref's tell me to stop first. (and I have enough sense to stop
It was law mistake
A lot of mistakes out there are interpretation. All HAL errors are interpretation. They know their laws back to front. But a lot of local ref's dont!
Sym
Well-Known Member
Alright this has gone on for to long
although reading it amuses me
bar the long posts
but serious refs can be shite
everyone makes mistakes
some just matter more
it's what makes football football
would you want a video ref or something for every little call ?
no
so just let it be
although reading it amuses me
bar the long posts
but serious refs can be shite
everyone makes mistakes
some just matter more
it's what makes football football
would you want a video ref or something for every little call ?
no
so just let it be
I think its funny that now we all assume that the penalty call was wrong. hah what if the ref actually madet he correct decision and the game was fine. just putting it out there hah!
And i got 28/40 a few years back when i was 14. This year i was nominated for state titles.
The test is a understanding of the rules, apart from the questions about the diameter of the ball, got that one wrong. Experience is everything, 28 in a test is another.
Videos refs haha. League made the right decision to use them .............
And i got 28/40 a few years back when i was 14. This year i was nominated for state titles.
The test is a understanding of the rules, apart from the questions about the diameter of the ball, got that one wrong. Experience is everything, 28 in a test is another.
Videos refs haha. League made the right decision to use them .............
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