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midfielder
Well-Known Member
A lot of detail in the following Herald Sun article with dates for the expansion.. well past what has been talked about ... two and a half years away..
The following article sits behind a paywall so I have copied it in part…
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/f...9/news-story/bc654d06b2b6e24ea013dfd84878073f
A-League expansion plans revealed with two new teams to join in 2018-19
DAVID DAVUTOVIC, Herald Sun
December 5, 2016 9:00pm
Subscriber only
AT least two new teams are set to join the A-League in 2018-19, with league chief Greg O’Rourke confirming that the expansion blueprint will be unveiled in February.
Meanwhile a new A-League broadcast deal is edging closer with Thursday the deadline for broadcasters to submit their tender documents.
FFA has spent the past two months negotiating and it’s understood that most Free-to-Air networks along with Optus and Bein Sports have expressed interest in broadcasting A-League from next season.
Fox Sports has last rights under the terms of the current $40m-a-year deal, with FFA hopeful the new deal will hit the $80m mark
Expansion is intertwined with TV negotiations, with FFA advising network executives to submit an additional figure for a 12-team competition in addition to a bid for the current 10-team rights.
FFA refused to comment on TV negotiations, but O’Rourke said FFA was investigating how and when the A-League could house 14-18 teams.
“The FFA have got a shortlist of consultants that we are talking to regarding the project scope which will help us build the framework,’’ O’Rourke said.
“We expect that that framework will be ready to put to board in February and if that’s approved it will form the guidelines to add an A-League team to an expanded competition with a view to this coming in the second year of the deal of broadcast, 2018-19.
“Our primary focus will be on the expansion of the A-League over the next 5-7 years and primarily focused on what is the right number of teams and what are the right geographies.
“That’s not to suggest that inter-dependencies of future promotion and relegation or a second division will be ignored but it won’t be primary focus.’’
No less than 10 clubs/consortiums want to join the A-League, with TV executives prefer expansion into bigger markets.
South Melbourne officials met with FFA last week while a joint Sutherland-St George-Illawarra bid is likely to be submitted, with further bids from Victoria, Brisbane and Tasmania set to be formally submitted.
O’Rourke said no bids would be rushed through before the strategy was revealed.
“Any meetings prior to the framework being finalized and the board approving it are more about being respectful and wanting to listen to interested parties who want to ask questions. It’s not about having detailed discussions,’’ he said.
“The FFA doesn’t want potential aspirants to spend time and money putting together a proposal and talking to government in a formal way, until they have a clarity of what is required.
“We have been saying for sometime that any new team in the A-League will need to add value for all existing stakeholders.’’
The following article sits behind a paywall so I have copied it in part…
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/f...9/news-story/bc654d06b2b6e24ea013dfd84878073f
A-League expansion plans revealed with two new teams to join in 2018-19
DAVID DAVUTOVIC, Herald Sun
December 5, 2016 9:00pm
Subscriber only
AT least two new teams are set to join the A-League in 2018-19, with league chief Greg O’Rourke confirming that the expansion blueprint will be unveiled in February.
Meanwhile a new A-League broadcast deal is edging closer with Thursday the deadline for broadcasters to submit their tender documents.
FFA has spent the past two months negotiating and it’s understood that most Free-to-Air networks along with Optus and Bein Sports have expressed interest in broadcasting A-League from next season.
Fox Sports has last rights under the terms of the current $40m-a-year deal, with FFA hopeful the new deal will hit the $80m mark
Expansion is intertwined with TV negotiations, with FFA advising network executives to submit an additional figure for a 12-team competition in addition to a bid for the current 10-team rights.
FFA refused to comment on TV negotiations, but O’Rourke said FFA was investigating how and when the A-League could house 14-18 teams.
“The FFA have got a shortlist of consultants that we are talking to regarding the project scope which will help us build the framework,’’ O’Rourke said.
“We expect that that framework will be ready to put to board in February and if that’s approved it will form the guidelines to add an A-League team to an expanded competition with a view to this coming in the second year of the deal of broadcast, 2018-19.
“Our primary focus will be on the expansion of the A-League over the next 5-7 years and primarily focused on what is the right number of teams and what are the right geographies.
“That’s not to suggest that inter-dependencies of future promotion and relegation or a second division will be ignored but it won’t be primary focus.’’
No less than 10 clubs/consortiums want to join the A-League, with TV executives prefer expansion into bigger markets.
South Melbourne officials met with FFA last week while a joint Sutherland-St George-Illawarra bid is likely to be submitted, with further bids from Victoria, Brisbane and Tasmania set to be formally submitted.
O’Rourke said no bids would be rushed through before the strategy was revealed.
“Any meetings prior to the framework being finalized and the board approving it are more about being respectful and wanting to listen to interested parties who want to ask questions. It’s not about having detailed discussions,’’ he said.
“The FFA doesn’t want potential aspirants to spend time and money putting together a proposal and talking to government in a formal way, until they have a clarity of what is required.
“We have been saying for sometime that any new team in the A-League will need to add value for all existing stakeholders.’’
VicMariner
Well-Known Member
At first look that seems too far away, but:
If the "expansion framework" is released in February you can imagine that this season will be pretty much over when the selection is made. This timetable gives the new clubs a full season to prepare for entry.
Seems fair enough.
So the rest of this season and then one more full season at 10 teams.
dibo
Well-Known Member
I think what we're likely to see is:
2017/18: 10 teams (2 new teams announced for the following season)
2018/19: 12 teams (2 new teams introduced)
2019/20: 12 teams (2 new teams announced for the following season)
2020/21: 14 teams (2 new teams introduced)
That way the talk is about expansion the whole way. The second wave has options though. If the two new teams are struggling or the league is struggling, we might hold off.
If we're going absolutely batshit crazy then we might add four teams at once (the NSWRL did it back in the mid 90s to go from 16 to 20 in one hit!).
One key reason to go to 16 rather than 14 is the problem that 14 teams is actually a crap number for season length.
At 10 teams, we play 3 x 9 = 27.
At 12 we'd play 3 x 11 = 33.
At 14 it's awkward. You can either play 3 x 13 = 39, which is a bit long in an Australian context, or 2 x 13 = 26, which is probably too short.
16 is really good for us - 2 x 15 = 30, so you get a decent length season, and you can chuck another round on the FFA cup to boost that side of things (and boost the number of member federation teams involved), and you can give the finals series some real meat.
2017/18: 10 teams (2 new teams announced for the following season)
2018/19: 12 teams (2 new teams introduced)
2019/20: 12 teams (2 new teams announced for the following season)
2020/21: 14 teams (2 new teams introduced)
That way the talk is about expansion the whole way. The second wave has options though. If the two new teams are struggling or the league is struggling, we might hold off.
If we're going absolutely batshit crazy then we might add four teams at once (the NSWRL did it back in the mid 90s to go from 16 to 20 in one hit!).
One key reason to go to 16 rather than 14 is the problem that 14 teams is actually a crap number for season length.
At 10 teams, we play 3 x 9 = 27.
At 12 we'd play 3 x 11 = 33.
At 14 it's awkward. You can either play 3 x 13 = 39, which is a bit long in an Australian context, or 2 x 13 = 26, which is probably too short.
16 is really good for us - 2 x 15 = 30, so you get a decent length season, and you can chuck another round on the FFA cup to boost that side of things (and boost the number of member federation teams involved), and you can give the finals series some real meat.
midfielder
Well-Known Member
https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/sport/a/33453039/tv-networks-to-sway-a-league-expansion/#page1
Football Federation Australia has asked TV networks to state their preferred A-League expansion club locations as part of negotiations for what they hope is a bumper new broadcast deal.
The long-anticipated agreement moved a step closer on Thursday, the deadline for network executives to submit their tender documents.
With two new teams to be added in the 2018-19 season - within the next four-year broadcast cycle - TV rights negotiations have become inextricably linked to expansion.
So much so that FFA chief executive David Gallop revealed the desires of networks would partly dictate where the governing body chooses to introduce those teams, on the premise that a deal's value could differ vastly depending whether a new franchise is based in southern Sydney, Brisbane or Tasmania.
"We want them to indicate when they come to us their attitude to not only expansion, but expansion where," Gallop said.
"It's not appropriate to go completely into the detail of discussions with media companies, but we have indicated that we're looking at the feasibility of adding teams.
"We want to add teams and therefore we've asked them for their view of a competition that is 12 teams, not 10."
Gallop said FFA was "not quite" pre-disposed to certain markets but conceded "it's certainly something that has been clear in our thinking for a number of years now".
"I've said for some time, expansion is more than the ability to set up a sustainable operation in a geographical location - that's only half the equation," he said.
"The other half of the equation is adding value to the whole competition and the game, in the sense that you provide something that is of value to our broadcasters, our national sponsors, and therefore the overall pie grows."
It means some expansion bidders could, for all intents and purposes, be out of contention even before FFA release their criteria in February, given the governing body hope to sign a new broadcast deal in the next couple of months.
Close to a dozen different parties are waiting on that criteria before they progress further with their proposals.
FFA are hopeful of a significant increase on its current deal worth $40 million a year, though Gallop recently tempered expectations of hitting their ambitious target of $80 million a year.
It's believed Optus, beIN Sports and most free-to-air networks have shown interest.
As incumbent rights holders, Fox Sports have last rights.
Football Federation Australia has asked TV networks to state their preferred A-League expansion club locations as part of negotiations for what they hope is a bumper new broadcast deal.
The long-anticipated agreement moved a step closer on Thursday, the deadline for network executives to submit their tender documents.
With two new teams to be added in the 2018-19 season - within the next four-year broadcast cycle - TV rights negotiations have become inextricably linked to expansion.
So much so that FFA chief executive David Gallop revealed the desires of networks would partly dictate where the governing body chooses to introduce those teams, on the premise that a deal's value could differ vastly depending whether a new franchise is based in southern Sydney, Brisbane or Tasmania.
"We want them to indicate when they come to us their attitude to not only expansion, but expansion where," Gallop said.
"It's not appropriate to go completely into the detail of discussions with media companies, but we have indicated that we're looking at the feasibility of adding teams.
"We want to add teams and therefore we've asked them for their view of a competition that is 12 teams, not 10."
Gallop said FFA was "not quite" pre-disposed to certain markets but conceded "it's certainly something that has been clear in our thinking for a number of years now".
"I've said for some time, expansion is more than the ability to set up a sustainable operation in a geographical location - that's only half the equation," he said.
"The other half of the equation is adding value to the whole competition and the game, in the sense that you provide something that is of value to our broadcasters, our national sponsors, and therefore the overall pie grows."
It means some expansion bidders could, for all intents and purposes, be out of contention even before FFA release their criteria in February, given the governing body hope to sign a new broadcast deal in the next couple of months.
Close to a dozen different parties are waiting on that criteria before they progress further with their proposals.
FFA are hopeful of a significant increase on its current deal worth $40 million a year, though Gallop recently tempered expectations of hitting their ambitious target of $80 million a year.
It's believed Optus, beIN Sports and most free-to-air networks have shown interest.
As incumbent rights holders, Fox Sports have last rights.
Forum Phoenix
Well-Known Member
Oh boy... I feel for the smaller areas. We struck football gold. Forever grateful.
FFC Mariner
Well-Known Member
Southern Sydney and a 2nd Brisbane team I'd bet
The Sutherland side they will want to replicate wanderers and marginalise the deluded twats from Moore Park who think they are a big club. Sutherland will dwarf them from day 1 with their numbers and finances
The Sutherland side they will want to replicate wanderers and marginalise the deluded twats from Moore Park who think they are a big club. Sutherland will dwarf them from day 1 with their numbers and finances
pjennings
Well-Known Member
I think a Southern Sydney team is a lock. It will probably be based at Shark Park. Hopefully it tries to market out to around Canterbury, the St George district and the Shire. TBH I would prefer a team at Campbelltown because that will be a huge area, it can draw from the East Hills line, up to Liverpool as well as the expansion to come.
Geelong and SMFC are probably the likely ones in Victoria with Geelong the favourite as 3 teams within 10 kms is a bit much and CFG will be urging the FFA not to bring them in.
I still think Tassie is a chance. A lot of sponsorship on board. A rectangular stadium during summer and government support. If Foxtel are the last bidders you would think that with such a low subscription rate in Tasmania it could be a target for them.
This is a picture of the current ground from a pre-season game and after that is the proposed stands
Geelong and SMFC are probably the likely ones in Victoria with Geelong the favourite as 3 teams within 10 kms is a bit much and CFG will be urging the FFA not to bring them in.
I still think Tassie is a chance. A lot of sponsorship on board. A rectangular stadium during summer and government support. If Foxtel are the last bidders you would think that with such a low subscription rate in Tasmania it could be a target for them.
This is a picture of the current ground from a pre-season game and after that is the proposed stands
VicMariner
Well-Known Member
No money for an oval! Rectangular stadium for Tassie or no deal. imo
http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/arti...ox-sports-set-agree-new-league-tv-deal-report
$50m per season from fox and Saturday night to be sold to free to air. Probably loser of BBL rights going off previous comments
$50m per season from fox and Saturday night to be sold to free to air. Probably loser of BBL rights going off previous comments
midfielder
Well-Known Member
Had some time to think in the car had to drive to Sydney and back..
If 80 million was the goal, they may actually get it or more, we are way to early to determine what the final figure will be. I think they will get the 80 million or go very close to it.
The deal as I understand it is Fox for the 10 team A-League will pay 57 million per year for 6 years including broadcast cost. Plus add on products to sell.
So Fox 57 million
Plus sale of Digital rights
Sale of Saturday night game to either 7, 9 or 10,
Sale of international rights to the A-League
Plus provision to grow to 12 or more teams with Fox to pick up broadcasting’s costs and the match can be sold to either Fox, a commercial FTA, or both.
Lets put some numbers behind wants known.
Fox 57 Million
Digital low 2 million high 7 million
FTA TV low 5 million high 15 million
Overseas sales ????
This is a low of 64 million plus international sales and a high of 79 million plus international sales
On top of this we can paid for Socceroo and Matilda matches by AFC and I have read 16 million per year.
Re the FTA TV, I think it will get a reasonable figure consider this.
SFC V WSW 3 games == cul to date 3 games
SFC V MV 3 games === cul to date 6 games
SFC V MH 3 games === cul to date 9 games
WSW V MV 3 games === cul to date 12 games
WSW V MH 3 games === cul to date 15 games
MV V MH 3 games === cul to date 18 games
MV V AU 3 games === cul to date 21 games
Roar games SFC, MV-
– MH, WSW 6 games === cul to date 27 games
Plus finals 5 games === cul to date 32 games
Plus Socceroo friendlies 3 games == cul to date 35 games..
That is 35 quality games that should get decent crowds and rate. Also the FTA has no broadcast costs other than its panel.
Gallop can’t change the ratings..
Plus the sale of their new match, when they add another two teams.
If 80 million was the goal, they may actually get it or more, we are way to early to determine what the final figure will be. I think they will get the 80 million or go very close to it.
The deal as I understand it is Fox for the 10 team A-League will pay 57 million per year for 6 years including broadcast cost. Plus add on products to sell.
So Fox 57 million
Plus sale of Digital rights
Sale of Saturday night game to either 7, 9 or 10,
Sale of international rights to the A-League
Plus provision to grow to 12 or more teams with Fox to pick up broadcasting’s costs and the match can be sold to either Fox, a commercial FTA, or both.
Lets put some numbers behind wants known.
Fox 57 Million
Digital low 2 million high 7 million
FTA TV low 5 million high 15 million
Overseas sales ????
This is a low of 64 million plus international sales and a high of 79 million plus international sales
On top of this we can paid for Socceroo and Matilda matches by AFC and I have read 16 million per year.
Re the FTA TV, I think it will get a reasonable figure consider this.
SFC V WSW 3 games == cul to date 3 games
SFC V MV 3 games === cul to date 6 games
SFC V MH 3 games === cul to date 9 games
WSW V MV 3 games === cul to date 12 games
WSW V MH 3 games === cul to date 15 games
MV V MH 3 games === cul to date 18 games
MV V AU 3 games === cul to date 21 games
Roar games SFC, MV-
– MH, WSW 6 games === cul to date 27 games
Plus finals 5 games === cul to date 32 games
Plus Socceroo friendlies 3 games == cul to date 35 games..
That is 35 quality games that should get decent crowds and rate. Also the FTA has no broadcast costs other than its panel.
Gallop can’t change the ratings..
Plus the sale of their new match, when they add another two teams.
Don't forget it is $57m on average, therefore I suspect next season is lower say around $40m hence the salary cap being touted at $3m and clubs getting $3.6m. When the league expands the dollars increase, I also suspect in the 6 year deal there is more than just expansion possibilities of two extra clubs, I would guess maybe up to 4. Also the six year figure has built in incentives and expansion so it may not be until the later years of the deal but they maybe getting in excess of the $57m per year. Seems like a good deal to take the league to the next level over a six year period.
pjennings
Well-Known Member
From the Advertiser.
Fox will commit $51 million next season, rising to $56 million per annum thereafter with the potential to earn an extra $7.5 million per year for the last two years if certain TV ratings triggers are met.
Fox Sports and FFA have agreed a “safety net” in case a deal falls through to simulcast Saturday night games by buying it back for $4 million.
Fox will commit $51 million next season, rising to $56 million per annum thereafter with the potential to earn an extra $7.5 million per year for the last two years if certain TV ratings triggers are met.
Fox Sports and FFA have agreed a “safety net” in case a deal falls through to simulcast Saturday night games by buying it back for $4 million.
pjennings
Well-Known Member
Patrick Delaney (Foxsports CEO) interview last night on the World of Football Show on SEN radio with David Davutovic and Michael Zappone. He was asked where he wants football to be in 6 years time, by the time this new deal ends, and his response was;
- they'd like ratings averaging 100k on Foxsports
- they'd like ratings averaging 200-300k on a FTA channel
- more teams, so the comp doesn't become stale, and the same clubs don't keep playing each other 3 times in the FFA cup, plus FFA Cup and Finals
- he was also asked about expansion, and he said that he didn't care about how many Foxtel boxes or current customers were in that area (he was being asked about Tasmania specifically), it was more about growing the comp and the sport. New teams needed to add to the competition.
- they'd like ratings averaging 100k on Foxsports
- they'd like ratings averaging 200-300k on a FTA channel
- more teams, so the comp doesn't become stale, and the same clubs don't keep playing each other 3 times in the FFA cup, plus FFA Cup and Finals
- he was also asked about expansion, and he said that he didn't care about how many Foxtel boxes or current customers were in that area (he was being asked about Tasmania specifically), it was more about growing the comp and the sport. New teams needed to add to the competition.
Forum Phoenix
Well-Known Member
Gee I hope that vision is shared at FFA HQ.
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