Mariners Squad - 2019-2020

[Forum Phoenix]

I could see Harold letting us play 4-3-3 with a line up of
Miller - Ziggy - Rowles - Clisby
DDS —— Kim —— Duric
Harold—— Muzz ——Oar

Which gives us the option of some decent subs with Stensness, Silvera, Nisbet, Jair, Simon among others putting their hand up. 4-2-3-1 another option with the same names.

With that line up I think a 4231 or 433 variant, 4213, would better suit as Kim Duric and DDS are all better more centrally deployed imo.

 

[turbo]

With that line up I think a 4231 or 433 variant, 4213, would better suit as Kim Duric and DDS are all better more centrally deployed imo.

In that set up I was seeing the mids playing relatively narrow as I agree with what you’re saying. One thing I’d like to see is is taking some pressure off DDS to provide the creativity we lack, if we were to play 4-3-3 or similar maybe there will be more passing channels to give him simple options.

 

[onto it]

In that set up I was seeing the mids playing relatively narrow as I agree with what you’re saying. One thing I’d like to see is is taking some pressure off DDS to provide the creativity we lack, if we were to play 4-3-3 or similar maybe there will be more passing channels to give him simple options.

I think you nailed it. Keep it simple for DDS.

 

[jacobsfl]

Chris Harold. He's fast, so he'll be able to get us forward a bit better than Lewis Miller (so he can drop back and defend). If he starts on the right-wing, it might mean DDS continues to play centrally as mentioned above. This is a move I like.

Heaps of A-League pedigree.

 

[true believer]

Chris Harold. He's fast, so he'll be able to get us forward a bit better than Lewis Miller (so he can drop back and defend). If he starts on the right-wing, it might mean DDS continues to play centrally as mentioned above. This is a move I like.

Heaps of A-League pedigree.

definitely a good signing .can score as well

 

[marinermick]

GG definitely to Victory

 

[Capn Gus Bloodbeard]

GG definitely to Victory

thought he was going to Asia

 

[turbo]

Playing ACL he said

 

[Capn Gus Bloodbeard]

can't help but wonder - why can other clubs do a complete rebuild and be back in the game in a season, yet we're on, what, season 5? And we're not really looking better. We have no front line, a questionable back line, no real core of the team, and (probably) no keeper next year.
I still feel like next year is 'Year 1 of the rebuild' again.

 

[turbo]

can't help but wonder - why can other clubs do a complete rebuild and be back in the game in a season, yet we're on, what, season 5? And we're not really looking better. We have no front line, a questionable back line, no real core of the team, and (probably) no keeper next year.
I still feel like next year is 'Year 1 of the rebuild' again.

Because we don’t seem to have someone in management that stops poor decisions. As much as he’s one of our better players right now Simon is a perfect example, no one else was offering him a gig and on cheap $ at Sydney as a way to shut down games. We offer a big multi year deal and the arm band. Was weemac suing us still at the time we approached him? Unwanted at the nix. Visa space. Pearce. Let Jem and Tom go. Got rid of Baro for Cisse.
And that’s just off the top of my head. We don’t have someone that says “you want to do what? Really? Why?”

 

[Ads]

can't help but wonder - why can other clubs do a complete rebuild and be back in the game in a season, yet we're on, what, season 5? And we're not really looking better. We have no front line, a questionable back line, no real core of the team, and (probably) no keeper next year.
I still feel like next year is 'Year 1 of the rebuild' again.

* We don’t stack our starting 11.
We don’t use the cap well cause we aren’t willing to spend money.
* If you put in 4 scholarships, 2 home grown, 2 marquee/loyalty or more scholarship with a minimum squad of 20 players and then spend the cap (3.2mil)
You have an average of $266,00 per player!

You could make anybody a marquee, doesn’t have to be big $.
But at the end of the day it’s about making good decisions.

And we have now missed the boat!
Those first 2 bad seasons were key and as stated, even if we had the money, for experienced players it is almost career suicide/embarrassment.

Our juniors stand out and move on because they have energy and spark that other teams like to support their quality experienced players.

The only way that we will rebuild properly is to hire a coach that players will follow to the club. Which means Staj would need to go and the Mariners biggest investment would be the coach.
Or alternatively...
Splash on 2 marquees that early in offseason that would attract other players to come play around them and take us seriously.
(This approach was tried with Oar & McCormack which was too late in in the off-season and failed anyway)

If we are serious about competing we do need to almost finalise next season squad in the background now. And use any new big names from overseas to start selling to other Aussie players now.

And with the results showing this year, what decent Aussie player would want to join?
We will get the scraps and simply be a youth developing selling club that doesn’t even do that well.
(Especially compared to the Europe factory)

 

[Capn Gus Bloodbeard]

Yep. We need to find a key, expensive striker and/or playmaker. MC needs to spend. There's no way around it.
We need an expensive player in their prime. Can't keep trying to find the gold - we've shown, consistently for the last 5 years, that we're actually pretty crap at it.
Also, we have to compete against every other club in the world trying to do the same thing.
Our name is mud. It surely is.
So that means we NEED to have the sort of player where others say 'man, I want to play alongside him. Imagine what I could learn just by training alongside that guy, let alone playing with him'. The sort of player who becomes an advertising point for the club - and the sort that every other team needs to spend a bit of time discussing how they're going to deal with him.
Without that player, we're not going to get past Year 1 of the rebuild phase.
Staj needs to have an amazing plan for next season recruitment-wise.

 

[marinermick]

Yep. We need to find a key, expensive striker and/or playmaker. MC needs to spend. There's no way around it.
We need an expensive player in their prime. Can't keep trying to find the gold - we've shown, consistently for the last 5 years, that we're actually pretty crap at it.
Also, we have to compete against every other club in the world trying to do the same thing.
Our name is mud. It surely is.
So that means we NEED to have the sort of player where others say 'man, I want to play alongside him. Imagine what I could learn just by training alongside that guy, let alone playing with him'. The sort of player who becomes an advertising point for the club - and the sort that every other team needs to spend a bit of time discussing how they're going to deal with him.
Without that player, we're not going to get past Year 1 of the rebuild phase.
Staj needs to have an amazing plan for next season recruitment-wise.

Shaun stated on radio today that they are very reluctant to spend big on one player because of the risk that player turns out to be a flop. He cited Meier as an example. It sounds like McCormack really burnt MC.

 

[Capn Gus Bloodbeard]

Shaun stated on radio today that they are very reluctant to spend big on one player because of the risk that player turns out to be a flop. He cited Meier as an example. It sounds like McCormack really burnt MC.

I simply can't see any way forwards without doing that.
So, that sounds like we're headed for the 'North Queensland Fury' page of the history books unless MC either gets counselling for his McCormack PTSD or sells the club.
He cannot keep expecting us to find undervalued players.
The other problem is that not only is it extremely difficult to find and sign such players - but even harder to find ones that fit into Staj's particular system. So it makes recruitment highly restrictive.

We're not Season 1 under Lawrie finding golden players on the smell of an oily rag. that's never going to happen again.
It's absolute hubris to think we're going to be better than every other HAL club and finding undervalued players.

 

[turbo]

Shaun stated on radio today that they are very reluctant to spend big on one player because of the risk that player turns out to be a flop. He cited Meier as an example. It sounds like McCormack really burnt MC.

That’s a reasonable fear but we do need to take a chance and stack the core of our team. We don’t have the cash to do a full Sydney style job but a striker, a play maker and CB as a starting point would go a long way towards making us competitive. Get it settled early and show players we are serious.
Then you start filling around them with some youth like Rowles, Stensness, Nisbet, Miller. Pick up a few decent but not outstanding players and fill out your visa spots with the gaps you can’t address locally.

Right now we have too much of our limited funds tied up in players we barely see. No point having depth if your first team is rubbish.

And yes we might have to spend a bit more too but what’s the cost of driving fans away season after season?

 

[Capn Gus Bloodbeard]

yep. Spend a bit more to attract players for one or two seasons so that we won't have to after that AND we'll have more sustainable crowds.
MC needs to make a decision - either invest what's needed to improve the team, or sell. Can't keep going on low budget and expect we can just find better undervalued players.
That saying about the definition of insanity comes to mind....

 

[pjennings]

*
And with the results showing this year, what decent Aussie player would want to join?

Sorry to cut your post down to the one line. But attracting Aussie players should not be the focus. Staj has bought 4 visa players. 3 have been relatively successful. Jair less so but probably cheap. None are signed for next year.

The focus needs to be getting the the Aussie players we want to keep re-signed and getting the visa players right - probably 6 next year. If we assume (no guarantee) that we can keep Birraz then he and the 6 visa players make up 7 of the first XI.

I think the visa players need to be LB, CB, DM, AM, CM, CF. I believe all the visa players are up for renewal (Ziggy may be a 1 + 1)

So the first team squad would look like

-------------------Birraz--------------------
Oz RB---Visa CB----Oz CB--Visa LB
-----------------Visa DM-------------------
Oz RM--------Visa CM---------Oz LM
----------------Visa AM------------------
-----------------Visa Striker----------

With the right visa players attracting decent Aussie players should not be a problem.

We have 9 players for next season - Clisby, De Silva, Murray, Pearce, Rowles,Tongyik, Miller, Silvera, Stensness
Add 6 visa players and you get to 15 players. So we have to attract 8 Aussie players.


Fox, Melling, Shabow, Majok, Harold, Simon, Roberts, Birraz and Nisbet contracts are all up I think.Oar is leaving. At the moment the only ones that we probably all agree on renewing are Birraz and Nisbet - so those two plus 6 others.

 

[LFCMariners]

Because we don’t seem to have someone in management that stops poor decisions. As much as he’s one of our better players right now Simon is a perfect example, no one else was offering him a gig and on cheap $ at Sydney as a way to shut down games. We offer a big multi year deal and the arm band. Was weemac suing us still at the time we approached him? Unwanted at the nix. Visa space. Pearce. Let Jem and Tom go. Got rid of Baro for Cisse.
And that’s just off the top of my head. We don’t have someone that says “you want to do what? Really? Why?”

Is that down to somebody at board level or in the football department, or the manager himself? Because IIRC, these underwhelming signings only became commonplace after 2014 when Arnie left. Did anybody else depart with him?

I don't watch every CCM game but saying that, for the current deficiencies of the squad they look better than they have for a long time. At least better than under the tenures of MM and Okon. The last couple of weeks have highlighted the sloppiness of passing and cheap turnovers when transitioning the ball upfield, not helped by how sorely this team is missing a proven forward/ striker who knows how to net goals from open play. Yet overall, since Staj came in the teams has played with more grit, more fight. They don't concede and go to sleep or roll over like they used to. Defence and match fitness are both notably better, and this is highly important seeing as everybody has apparently forgotten how to score from open play at the moment. Unless there's an irredeemable collapse from here on, I'd be fine keeping Staj into next season and giving him the freedom to start now in recruiting the team he wants for 2020/21. If he was to be moved on and we had to pick between some big name player signings or a proven coach who's popular with players, I'd go with the coach. A great coach can attract good signings without needing to pay inflated fees, and they have more of an impact on the direction of the squad. So if MC just invests here, he saves elsewhere.

Plus, spending big and signing a star marquee player or two means nothing if you don't have the right coach managing them. The success this club enjoyed between 2005 and 2013 despite a smaller budget and area demographic had a lot to do with Lawrie and Arnie. Without them CCM could've just been also-rans with little club stability, which is something money can't save you from. SFC were a club with money to spend, but not a solid club culture- then Arnie arrived and helped lay the foundations for the team we've seen ever since 2015. Again, purely coincidence that CCM turning shit and SFC becoming a great club happened the same time Arnie went from one to the other?

 

[Forum Phoenix]

can't help but wonder - why can other clubs do a complete rebuild and be back in the game in a season, yet we're on, what, season 5? And we're not really looking better. We have no front line, a questionable back line, no real core of the team, and (probably) no keeper next year.
I still feel like next year is 'Year 1 of the rebuild' again.

For mine A) because you can never have players like Kennedy, Clisby or Cisse etc in a starting lineup and not be routinely punished for it. Don’t have to all be world beaters, but it’s a team sport, and only as strong as your weakest link etc...

B) you must have a quality spine. We haven’t had a real striker since Roy left or a real 10 since Rogic.

 

[Forum Phoenix]

Sorry to cut your post down to the one line. But attracting Aussie players should not be the focus. Staj has bought 4 visa players. 3 have been relatively successful. Jair less so but probably cheap. None are signed for next year.

The focus needs to be getting the the Aussie players we want to keep re-signed and getting the visa players right - probably 6 next year. If we assume (no guarantee) that we can keep Birraz then he and the 6 visa players make up 7 of the first XI.

I think the visa players need to be LB, CB, DM, AM, CM, CF. I believe all the visa players are up for renewal (Ziggy may be a 1 + 1)

So the first team squad would look like

-------------------Birraz--------------------
Oz RB---Visa CB----Oz CB--Visa LB
-----------------Visa DM-------------------
Oz RM--------Visa CM---------Oz LM
----------------Visa AM------------------
-----------------Visa Striker----------

With the right visa players attracting decent Aussie players should not be a problem.

We have 9 players for next season - Clisby, De Silva, Murray, Pearce, Rowles,Tongyik, Miller, Silvera, Stensness
Add 6 visa players and you get to 15 players. So we have to attract 8 Aussie players.


Fox, Melling, Shabow, Majok, Harold, Simon, Roberts, Birraz and Nisbet contracts are all up I think.Oar is leaving. At the moment the only ones that we probably all agree on renewing are Birraz and Nisbet - so those two plus 6 others.

Thanks for spelling that all out PJ. Much appreciated.

I feel sorry for Staj, these last few losses have likely made it another almost impossible task to rebuild as I’m sure he’d like. He and Anton have a lot more room to move. But agree with others, if Mike isn’t prepared to risk losing even more of his money this year, the future is looking very grim.

f**king McCormack. He really hurt us as a club. We finally lash out on a pedigree visa striker, and we get the worst possible outcome from it.