Are we getting screwed by Bluetongue Stadium?

[dibo]

From the thread on the Sharks moving, I had a poke around at a few things - in the Daily Errorgraph there's the following:

Sharks approve Central Coast move

By Josh Massoud | May 06, 2009 12:00am

A SHOCK move to the Central Coast is now Cronulla's final salvation, with the Shire battlers last night voting to sell off half their home games to survive beyond this season.

Sharks CEO Tony Zappia held urgent talks with NRL boss David Gallop yesterday afternoon about financial incentives to transfer five Toyota Stadium fixtures to Gosford - on addition to one in Adelaide - until 2014.

Zappia then rushed back to Cronulla to address the entire nine-man board, who voted unanimously to endorse the proposal around 8;30pm. Cronulla officials have traditionally opposed any form of relocation, but now have little choice because of the club's dire financial position.
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Its licensed venue, Sharkies, has been on the edge of insolvency since directors were forced to rely on a $500,000 loan from St George Bank to pay wages over Christmas.

Phil Rothfield's blog: Have Sharks made right move

Management is continuing discussions with the bank about a refinance package to settle some $3 million of debt. But to do so they need liquidity, which is drying up on the back of poor crowds this season.

Zappia budgeted for an average of 13,000 fans a game but has only managed 9000 as the team languishes in outright last place.

Directors have promoted a $110 million residential and business redevelopment adjacent to Sharkies as their saviour, but the plan faces opposition from conservation groups. The board now accepts that even if the long-awaited development is approved by Sutherland Shire Council, the Sharks cannot keep their head above water until its completion.

With the project expected to take several years, a medium-term solution is required to deliver cash flow to stave off creditors and pay wages.

During the past week, that solution has emerged on the Central Coast. Following last night's historic resolution, Cronulla will now host five games over the next five years at Bluetongue Stadium, which offers teams a minimum $100,000 guarantee per match. At their present crowd average, the Sharks are losing about $25,000 a game at Toyota Stadium.

"We need to expand our brand and get into new markets to generate new revenue streams," Zappia said.

"We're landlocked in the Shire at the moment. The fact is we need to create more fans and sponsors, while continuing to service our traditional territory.

"There's an opportunity on the Central Coast for us and we've voted to pursue that."

The NRL is offering Sydney clubs $8 million for wholesale relocation, and Zappia yesterday discussed the possibility of Gallop releasing a portion of that incentive to the Sharks for transferring five matches up the F3. Zappia and Gallop were locked in talks for more than an hour. The pair agreed Zappia would provide a written proposal that Gallop will present to the NRL partnership board at its next meeting.

Gallop said: "We'll consider any proposal but we've always taken the view that relocation only works properly if it's full relocation."

Zappia and Sharks president Barry Pierce discussed the relocation plan last week, before the CEO's visit to NRL headquarters at 4pm yesterday.

Pierce last night accepted that local fans would be upset, but pleaded with them to understand the club's plight.

"We are doing this to ensure the club's survival by broadening our market," Pierce said.

"It's not a merger and it's not a relocation. We'll still be playing big games against the likes of St George Illawarra and the Bulldogs in our traditional area.

The move will be the burning issue in the lead-up to this month's football and leagues club elections, with three candidates challenging the current board over the state of the club.

The important bit is in bold.

What the f**k is Bluetongue doing offering $100k to people hosting matches at the stadium? Why aren't we getting that cash? If in fact, we are getting $100k guaranteed per game, where is it? That would be $1.1 million per season. In addition to our sponsorship (two years ago that came to over $3 million per season, though I'm sure this has fallen in light of the GFC) you'd think we'd be more than self-sufficient...

My suspicion is that we're not getting anything of the sort, given that previous forum discussions hinted at games costing us about $60k a pop and that we don't break even til we hit crowds of about 13k (which we don't get, hence taking games elsewhere this year to cut losses).

While some may say that this is a payment to entice new tenants and increase total use (in terms of match days that make money for the ground), that money is essentially paid for their by other income source - i.e. us.

How about they *don't* pay $500k to the Sharks and instead reduce the rent to our club or spend more money on improving that joke they call a pitch?

If we're getting screwed, then the club should be going public.

There's no point having a Central Coast club subsidising a part-relocation of a Sydney club.

There's no point in having a Central Coast club moving its games because it can't afford to play at home.

There's also no point having a Central Coast club if the stadium they pay through the nose to use simply cannot provide a surface up to the required standard.

 

[Gopher of Pern]

I thought the cash incentive was from the NRL, not the stadium, but I could be wrong.

 

[clarence]

The irony of all this is that Cronulla are a club that's located in much the same locale as us, in their Shire.

They haven't had much success with good draws from the NRL and the Saturday night fixtures, for them, are washouts - no one turns up. Night time matches don't go down well in the winter for the families that are their main fan base these days.

The club is in dire financial circumstances and this proposal may be the last thing that Zappia does before he's poached to Parramatta and try and stabilise that club.

I say let them come to Gosford. The folks here can smell the fear, and know they are only coming here because they are strapped for cash, not because they want to relocate permanently and become a part of the Coast scene.

This is probably one of Singo's little stunts. He may have personally laid the money down for the club to play the games here, but in the end, they won't get that much money from the games they relocate & someone - Singo, NRL or Cronulla - are going to be out of pocket. The sooner that the NRL and folks like Singo realise that, the better.

I suppose we could all grab some free tickets to the game (which will be a plenty), buy nothing and completely stuff up their marketing ploy by standing in Bay 16 and singing Football songs!

 

[Paolo]

Cronulla already have an active(by rl standards)supporters group singing football songs at their games

 

[dibo]

I'm not talking about Cronulla - there's a thread for that already. I'm talking about whether the stadium is screwing the club. I'm aware that the NRL has a standing offer of $8 million for any club that moves to the Coast, but the article says that the stadium is offering up cash (in much the same way as ANZ Stadium does).

 

[marinermick]

I'm not talking about Cronulla - there's a thread for that already. I'm talking about whether the stadium is screwing the club. I'm aware that the NRL has a standing offer of $8 million for any club that moves to the Coast, but the article says that the stadium is offering up cash (in much the same way as ANZ Stadium does).

I suppose Clarence broached that by stating that Singo is the one stumping up the cash.

Agree, we are getting screwed but they need new business to the stadium to keep it a going concern.

 

[midfielder]

I think as others have said its the NRL paying the money.... but Dibbo is right when he questions our stadium deal... at one stage last year we where going to get BT, then it looks like the NRL are going to put a team up here and ..OHHH that was just talk from the Mariners we just listen that's all.. That always sounded BS to me as I cannot believe our management would broadcast the fact we may be buying the rights if it was only talk at our end.

I am ever mindful that Singo for all he has done for us is at heart a RL tragic.. his radio station 2GB buy the radio broadcast rights for RL ... he has in the past offered to fund any RL team any loses for some years I forget how many but it was a lot and I think he also offered a cash amount as well.

What is so frustrating is Singo got the rights for a song in the first place .. and the stadium was build by the NSW government not RL ... maybe for Norths to play at but they f**ked up... To the overall point Dibbo is making are we getting screwed and having a RL tragic in charge of the ground who wants a RL team on the coast has always made me feel a little uneasy.. Especially playing next to a leagues club who prior to the Mariners starting where a full on leagues club no different to any other.. with a huge support at management level for RL..

My understanding (an exceptional good source) was we needed 11, 000 fans to break even in Hal 1, given our cost have gone up the 13, 000 crowd to break even sounds right to me.

Hopefully, but not expecting,  local media to put some heat on stadium management.

It does raise a problem football has in stadium rights. Being the Johnny come lately's aside from Hindmarsh & Perth's home ground & MV in the future all grounds are controlled by RL clubs ... as much as I hate the SCUM they are getting screwed,  the Roar looks  have gone  broke over the stadium cost...GC also are on a much lessor deal than the Titians..

Very big future issue access and costs of government stadiums...

 

[Bladesman]

The $100k is not from the NRL it is the stadium, the only way they get money from the NRL is a full relocation. 

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,25438492-5018866,00.html

Bluetongue Stadium managing director Monique Marks said the move would be successful because Cronulla were not pretending to be the Central Coast's team.

"They're not saying we're relocating ... it's just like (fans) saying will they support the Roosters bringing two game here or Manly bringing two games here," she said.

"There's a lot of Sharks fans up here that will support the games."

Marks said she had been in negotiations with Cronulla but no deal had been finalised, including the guaranteed match fee.

 

[midfielder]

The $100k is not from the NRL it is the stadium, the only way they get money from the NRL is a full relocation. 

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,25438492-5018866,00.html

Bluetongue Stadium managing director Monique Marks said the move would be successful because Cronulla were not pretending to be the Central Coast's team.

"They're not saying we're relocating ... it's just like (fans) saying will they support the Roosters bringing two game here or Manly bringing two games here," she said.

"There's a lot of Sharks fans up here that will support the games."

Marks said she had been in negotiations with Cronulla but no deal had been finalised, including the guaranteed match fee.

Then f**k Me why we do we pay so much.

 

[midfielder]

Say we play 11 games it costs us $ 660, 000.... the Sharks come for 5 years 5 games a year and each year get $ 500, 000 per year... Someone must have a picture of someone because no matter how you do the maths it don't add up..

 

[Blair]

We should make our own ground at tuggerah.

 

[Wombat]

Victory have just built their own stadium which apparently is going to be a little beauty.

 

[FFC Mariner]

Victory have just built their own stadium which apparently is going to be a little beauty.

I think you'll find the Vic Govt put most of the money up (awaits correction) and as the NSW Govt chipped in for BT (and have even less $$ than CCM), no chance of something similar here

 

[Jesus]

Victory have just built their own stadium which apparently is going to be a little beauty.

I think you'll find the Vic Govt put most of the money up (awaits correction) and as the NSW Govt chipped in for BT (and have even less $$ than CCM), no chance of something similar here

Entirely VIC govt owned.

Bluey was paid for by state and fed i think maybe even council. They wont build a second stadium on the coast as that would make bluey worthless without a major tennant.

 

[georgemladenov]

Time for McCabe to build us a A Le Coq Arena at Tuggerah. 10000 capacity, can hold 25000 for concerts.

Perfect for us.

 

[mariners4ever]

Time for McCabe to build us a A Le Coq Arena at Tuggerah. 10000 capacity, can hold 25000 for concerts.

Perfect for us.

needs palm trees

 

[RADINHO]

Time for McCabe to build us a A Le Coq Arena at Tuggerah. 10000 capacity, can hold 25000 for concerts.

Perfect for us.

needs palm trees

hahahaha

 

[Sean]

10000 capacity?!

 

[Arabmariner]

10000 capacity?!

Why would we need much more?

 

[dibo]

We don't need a smaller ground. We just need a ground that doesn't screw us over completely.