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"I for one welcome our insect overlords" - The Politics Thread
- Thread starter FFC Mariner
- Start date
dibo said:
And a very poor reflection on our society is the fact he needs say absolutely no more than that to instantly gain the support of 5-10% of the voting public. I'm betting my left testicle, Gillard will bow to the temptation of gaining the same support and follow suit.
FFC Mariner
Well-Known Member
It worked for Andrew Fisher the Labor architect of the White Australia policy......................
dibo
Well-Known Member
FFC Mariner said:
It sure did. He was going in opposition to the Free Traders who wanted to import cheap sources of labour to boost unemployment and slash wages and living conditions for the working class to maximise profits to business. It was certainly racist and was ditched in the Whitlam years.
Labor opposes the improper use of s.457 temporary skilled worker visas as a backdoor to importing cheap unskilled labour to work in near-slavery conditions in factories and building sites for the same reason, without the racism. The basic motivation remains the same though - attempting to preserve living standards for workers by ensuring that dodgy bosses can't undercut fairly negotiated wages and abuse the human rights of the imported workers.
Labor opposed and repealed WorkChoices for the same reason - protecting workers from dodgy bosses. There's a theme here, right?
The Libs just want to stoke fear. There's no other purpose. They're not anti-immigration - immigration levels boomed under Howard. That's fine, we're running at near capacity with essentially full employment, that's a good thing.
They're just against a particular sort of migration - those people who are desperate enough to risk the high seas and claim asylum here. They are technically 'unauthorised arrivals' in that they didn't seek prior permission to land, but under the UN Convention they've every right to cross national borders if their intention is to claim asylum. They claim asylum, and if their claim is proven they stay. If it's not, they go home. It's really very simple. The vast majority of claimants have their claims proven and legitimately stay. A small number are refused. Those coming by boat make up a small fraction of our total intake. To be honest, I don't see the problem with them coming by boat other than that it's not safe. Oddly enough, if we regulated 'people smuggling' and just set up a port for people to be ferried over, we'd probably see better outcomes for both asylum seekers and for us. But in all this 'stop the boats' hysteria that argument seems to be too hard to make.
Capn Gus Bloodbeard
Well-Known Member
dibo said:
But dibo! You forget - Abbott admitted that sometimes politicians lie!
Apparently that makes him the greatest leader of the history of the world!
Seriously the number of people who like him JUST for that comment and his 'honesty' or whatever is absolutely terrifying.
Seriously - just because he may be honest about sometimes (only sometimes?) shooting his mouth off before he thinks, why does it make it ok that he does so?
You're right that the closest thing he has to a policy is sinking the incoming boats, which really plays up to all the xenophobic fools who don't have a clue just how insignificant the 'problem' of boat people really is.
I wasn't impressed with Rudd, but Abbott should be institutionalised. The thought of him in charge of the country is absolutely terrifying - and I think Gillard may have what it takes to topple him.
Please, oh god please.
FFC Mariner
Well-Known Member
At least he's married,not female and not a 'Ranga
this campaign will be horrific I reckon
ps - Atheist too - even Hawke had the brains to call himself an agnostic
this campaign will be horrific I reckon
ps - Atheist too - even Hawke had the brains to call himself an agnostic
Capn Gus Bloodbeard
Well-Known Member
Well she's already known to be an atheist - so anything short of a flat 'no' and she could be seen as flip-flopping on her personal beliefs in order to win votes.
Perhaps she could've spun some line to make it a 'no, but if.....'
Still, Australia isn't (for the most part) overly religious - and a lot of people were getting sick of what they've argued as religious undertones in some of Rudd's policies (though I think it's just bigotry - I don't really care what religion the leaders are, what I care about is how that religion affects policy - and with the Mad Monk in power, religion will be far closer to his ill-thought-out policies (well, he'd have to come up with one first) than it ever was with Rudd in power), so her atheism may well work in her favour.
While many people with strong religious convictions may avoid the atheist (though we know it's not like religious folk to be judgemental!), Abbott will suffer the same in reverse.
At least Gillard was honest and forthright.
People seem to love Abbott for that.............
Perhaps she could've spun some line to make it a 'no, but if.....'
Still, Australia isn't (for the most part) overly religious - and a lot of people were getting sick of what they've argued as religious undertones in some of Rudd's policies (though I think it's just bigotry - I don't really care what religion the leaders are, what I care about is how that religion affects policy - and with the Mad Monk in power, religion will be far closer to his ill-thought-out policies (well, he'd have to come up with one first) than it ever was with Rudd in power), so her atheism may well work in her favour.
While many people with strong religious convictions may avoid the atheist (though we know it's not like religious folk to be judgemental!), Abbott will suffer the same in reverse.
At least Gillard was honest and forthright.
People seem to love Abbott for that.............
dibo
Well-Known Member
This time with lil' peeps and numbers, just to make it clear.
Stupid reporting. Unsuccessful asylum seekers have always been deported whenever and wherever possible. This is just that they're talking specifically about a deal to return asylum seekers to one particular state.
There's a problem here. The Hazaras are an ethnic minority who have many people fleeing Afghanistan because they are being slaughtered. They can't be safely returned whether their claims are rejected or not.
The Tamils are fleeing Sri Lanka for the same reason. In each case the governments of the respective states deny that there's a problem, but facts on the ground are that people are being rounded up and shot and buried in mass graves.
This is the reason why the majority of claims are proven.
It's funny that back in the day when communism was the menace, people like Les Murray's family who smuggled themselves over the border from Stalinist Hungary and flew out here were basically welcomed. Nobody then denied their right to safety from murder by oppressive regimes.
We did the same for the Vietnamese in the 70s, we did the same for Bosnians in the 90s.
Now we're talking about people being murdered in any number of civil wars and thanks to unprincipled and irresponsible politicians (on both sides) [EDIT - and lazy media who like a beat up as much as a long boozy lunch] we worry about a meagre few showing up in boats.
zycie said:
Stupid reporting. Unsuccessful asylum seekers have always been deported whenever and wherever possible. This is just that they're talking specifically about a deal to return asylum seekers to one particular state.
There's a problem here. The Hazaras are an ethnic minority who have many people fleeing Afghanistan because they are being slaughtered. They can't be safely returned whether their claims are rejected or not.
The Tamils are fleeing Sri Lanka for the same reason. In each case the governments of the respective states deny that there's a problem, but facts on the ground are that people are being rounded up and shot and buried in mass graves.
This is the reason why the majority of claims are proven.
It's funny that back in the day when communism was the menace, people like Les Murray's family who smuggled themselves over the border from Stalinist Hungary and flew out here were basically welcomed. Nobody then denied their right to safety from murder by oppressive regimes.
We did the same for the Vietnamese in the 70s, we did the same for Bosnians in the 90s.
Now we're talking about people being murdered in any number of civil wars and thanks to unprincipled and irresponsible politicians (on both sides) [EDIT - and lazy media who like a beat up as much as a long boozy lunch] we worry about a meagre few showing up in boats.
FFC Mariner
Well-Known Member
139 boats crammed full of Burkha wearing terorists intent on destroying our whole Stralian way of life if you please.
midfielder
Well-Known Member
MUST WATCH .... THIS IS INCREDIBILITY GOOD .... WATCH RIGHT TO THE END...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qub4lWT6GNk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qub4lWT6GNk
Ah well. The two major parties successfully turning a pimple of a political item into major election issue, ridiculously out of proportion to it's actual minor status. It's easy, eh? Just aim at the lowest common denominator, prey on his and her uninformed bigotry that's been honed through an irrational abhorrence of those different to themselves, causing the viral like spread of unjustifiable fear and loathing of a tiny group of asylum seekers.
And why? Well, to gain the minority, but very loud populist vote the two major parties appear to value over all others. Excuse me for being honest, please. Any individual or group willing to do such a thing, deserves a similar level of respect to that afforded to a fart at a funeral. They are garbage that set a new low in the lowest common denominator.
So, what's left? A vote for the greens when they preference Labor? A donkey vote is a wasted vote, so what's really left when you want a party with different ideals to that of the conservatives? The Labor party I grew up with is long gone, I'm afraid, and the present party is disgustingly fraudulent in it's pretentious use of the same brand.
And why? Well, to gain the minority, but very loud populist vote the two major parties appear to value over all others. Excuse me for being honest, please. Any individual or group willing to do such a thing, deserves a similar level of respect to that afforded to a fart at a funeral. They are garbage that set a new low in the lowest common denominator.
So, what's left? A vote for the greens when they preference Labor? A donkey vote is a wasted vote, so what's really left when you want a party with different ideals to that of the conservatives? The Labor party I grew up with is long gone, I'm afraid, and the present party is disgustingly fraudulent in it's pretentious use of the same brand.
kevrenor
Well-Known Member
Curious posted ... A whole of lot of stuff that I agree with ... then ..
It doesn't matter who they preference .. it is your choice to chose your own preference. Just don't be lazy or ill informed - vote below the line and write your own preferences ... that's of course presuming you can find someone worthy ... it is certainly getting harder!
curious said:
It doesn't matter who they preference .. it is your choice to chose your own preference. Just don't be lazy or ill informed - vote below the line and write your own preferences ... that's of course presuming you can find someone worthy ... it is certainly getting harder!
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