CCM Membership feedback and thoughts

[Shaun Mielekamp]

Hi Everyone

In another thread there was a short discussion about calling our supporters "Members" instead of calling them "fans". This sparked my thoughts and I wanted to get some feedback and have the discussion about what is and what is not working as far as membership goes.

If we do a good job here at the club then the value to be a member as opposed to being a season ticket holder becomes very important. Members are the heartbeat of the club and it is of course a very important component of our financial capacity to run and grow the club.

But sometimes membership can have a negative affect if not done right as it can disenfranchise non-members who feel excluded from the club just because they haven't yet made the decision to or maybe dont have the ability to purchase a membership.

A strength in membership product is the ability to get things that other cannot such as members exclusive benefits, discounts, access, information etc etc.

Although the concept of creating an exclusive club is not really our brand at the Mariners hence why we have tried to gain some momentum for "IN-clusive" benefits where we try and give a member something which they can bring a friend along to so this is avoided. But if this is done to much then why should someone become a member?

Another core principle I believe in for membership is that our members have a voice and can talk directly to the club (although the irony here is that this exact post is open to anyone and not a benefit of membership).
However once again this can cause a negative experience for the non-member who feels excluded or for those members who first join but don't have the history and knowledge of the long term member can also feel non accepted by the club. We are seeing this on the Mariners Members facebook page for example where members are leaving because they are not included or understanding of the inside jokes. Some genuine comments get lost in the self policing nature of the site which usually leans towards a managing the ridiculous keyboard warrior but if misguided causes frustration.

On the flip side there is this perception that because we have members we have to tell them everything that is happening at the club even before we know what is happening. We have never made any promises of the sort so it is intriguing that there is this expectation - whilst we can only do what we can do in this space why do members feel like they should know more that the average fan? Shouldn't we get the word out as big as we can on most topics to promote the club in the best way possible?

The members functions and away trips are very very important and I feel we have made some great inroads here this season, hopefully the more these gain momentum the more people with become fans and the more fans will become members.

The tangible items such as the cap, lanyard and stickers are nice and important to ensure there is value for money in being a member but fade into insignificance if the season ticket holder doesn't get their membership card in a timely manner or if there is a problem with the card. This does put a huge burden on Dan to deliver but I am sure we all feel like there is a good person here at the helm of our membership.

Thanks for taking the time to discuss the concept of membership and let us know what is important and what can be improved. I would really hope we can fly past 7000 members next year hence why now is a really good time for the club to listen.

 

[offtheball]

I have been a long term gold member, 8 of the first ten years in fact. I let my membership lapse a couple of seasons ago because I became disallusioned with the club.

I paid my hard earned, approaching $500, in all good faith expecting the club to not give me stickers or lanyards but a reserved seat and a competitive football team.

The last straw for me was when the club issued a statement saying the club owed it to the fans to make no further sales. Lo and behold a week later an announcement was made that McGlinchey and McBreen were on there way out.

 

[Bladesman]

Being from an English football background I never really got the concept of memberships over here.

Always been very happy with the concept of Season Tickets, give me a good incentive to buy the tickets up front, I don't need lanyards, caps etc if I want those happy to purchase. As an incentive either give additional discounts for early purchase or something like a free kids season ticket. Make getting people to the game as cost effective as possible, especially as decisions have to be made around where to spend the budget.

I think club functions, open days etc should be for anyone and certainly wouldn't buy a membership to get those.

 

[Atomic]

With regards to members having a voice, you are never going to get a satisfactory solution. I've been a platinum member since season 2. During that time, I've changed seats three times because I cannot tolerate the naive comments from the people sitting around me... and they're all members. I have a low threshold for people who don't know what they're talking about, I guess. It's ok to be ignorant, but opening your mouth and letting the whole world know of your ignorance is another thing.

Peoples level of stupidity astounds me at times, and that comes through on the Facebook site... but having said that, I think the FB page is a terrific portal for the club and it's members to communicate through. As you say, there are the keyboard warriors... who annoy the shit out of me. A couple of them are regular posters on here. In fact, this forum was out of control about 5 years ago. Any comment was immediately smashed by a handful of smart arses, and it almost got to a stage where it wasn't worth the effort of posting. How that was resolved, I dont know, but we are in a much better place today compared to that period of time.

What do I want from a membership? My seat and a lanyard to put my card on (I usually have a handful of beers when heading to my seat, so the lanyard comes in handy). I'm more of a season ticket holder than a member. I dont go to pre or post match functions, or any other social event. I like to communications through FB, instagram and email and I liked the opportunity to buy finals tickets before the general public.

The match day experience is poor, and I appreciate the efforts the club is going to to improve it. Same with the team! Three seasons of hurt and embarrassment, and a scheduling that acts to minimise the crowd numbers... and you still have 6000 members! Your staff deserve a pat on the back.

For me to feel like a "member" will require some opportunity to have a say in the decisions being made by the club. A seat on the board that is voted on by the membership perhaps? Or the opportunity to vote on something??? I dont know... I'm not a business-type person. As it is, I feel like I buy a season ticket, and the club throws in some trinkets... most of which I ignore or throw away. In all honesty, I'm a member because I'm guaranteed a seat on half way that is not looking into the sun.

 

[midfielder]

Like Atomic I consider myself more a season ticket holder rather than a member.

Membership for me would involve being somehow involved in the clubs direction. Be that a seat on the board or standing committee with access to the board and able to table members views, desires and ideas etc.

 

[moomoo]

We have been members since the beginning and are for the main reasons of a guaranteed set each game and the discounted price if you go to all the games in a season. Really as a season ticket and it's way of supporting our local club.

This year for the first time we also got a satellite for the NSW Swifts netball club which gave us the goodies plus platinum ticket for 1 game. I won't be doing it again next year. Their communication with me on how to get my tickets plus the quality of the merchandise was terrible.
You guys are a million times better both with value for money & the contact between the member & the club.

Keep up the good work.

 

[pjennings]

Great topic Shaun. I'm sure you will get a myriad of different responses.

I, like a few others, view my membership as a season ticket, in the seats I want, with access to finals before the general public, so that I get a good choice there, plus a few trinkets thrown in.

You said 'A strength in membership product is the ability to get things that other cannot such as members exclusive benefits, discounts, access, information etc '.

I think in terms of benefits, the biggest one is the pricing of the tickets vs buying tickets each match. That is where the biggest value to being a member is. From the clubs point of view it means they know certain revenue is locked in, for the member they get cheaper seats than the 'fan'. I know the club actively tried to add value in the terms of discounts available to the member through a coupon book and hopefully that will continue and grow. These should be the incentive to be a member rather than a fan.

As for access and information that can be a bit of a two-edged sword. If the club has good news they should be sharing it with everyone. Equally, if there is a PR disaster happening the club needs to be talking to everyone. The members might get the information by an email or the facebook page, but that should not stop the club using whatever other distribution channel it wants to get its message out. At the same time the club needs to be able to 'control' its message. It might have good news, but chooses to withhold it until it has some 'clear air'. For example, a lot of contracts in Australia end at the end of May. Do the club make an announcement about a star player signing on June 1st, the day after State of Origin, or do they announce it when it does the best for the club in terms of attracting members and sponsors.

You also said 'Another core principle I believe in for membership is that our members have a voice and can talk directly to the club (although the irony here is that this exact post is open to anyone and not a benefit of membership).'

I actually don't think this is a benefit of membership. Not that we can't as members talk directly to the club, but that access is equally open to other fans or indeed the general public. I can't believe that if a member of the general public rang the Mariners that whoever answered the phone sell the Mariners in the best possible light including given them whatever information that it was appropriate to give. As you alluded to, what is appropriate to be shared, may be up for dispute by some, as might the timing.

I think that the members and fans do have a voice that is heard by the Mariners, probably more so than most clubs, where access is a lot more restricted. The problem may be that the members and fans don't always like what they hear. TBH, I'd rather hear the good news and the bad news whatever it is.

 

[JoyfulPenguin]

Hi Shaun,
First off I want to congratulate you and your team for the openness and candidness you have about the Mariners and especially how well you communicate to the fans and treat them with respect. As I was previously a Melbourne Heart member, and for a short time a City fan, I can say that you by far exceed them in how you listen and care what the community surrounding the Mariners wants and needs. You treat fans and members as human beings rather than just another monkey with cash to ignore.

My girlfriend (who purchased my Mariners membership for me) would also like to say that everything was easy to find, use and understand even for someone unfamiliar with a football club.

I'm a non-ticketed member as I live in Melbourne and proudly wear my Mariners member hat around town. I've noticed that we have a small following of Mariners in Melbourne, probably around 100, I would personally rather paying for a far more expensive membership if it were to possibly include games in a certain state, an interstate style membership (sometimes seen in the AFL) would encourage a few more in the away bay I feel but can completely understand if that is far too hard a thing to negotiate with other clubs.

Thanks for your time.

 

[Ancient Mariner]

Hi Shaun,

Thank you for taking the time to talk to us on this forum, this I believe is the most important thing you can do to link the club to the fans that cannot be over stated. It is also greatly appreciated and is probably the most important thing to keep the hardcore fans committed through these tough times. Love the way you cope with Wombat, 'bout time he offered you free Thai massage.

Thoughts on membership (which is the point of this thread).

As has been mentioned before there is a difference between buying a season ticket and becoming a member of an organisation.

In a previous life I was a member of a Rugby League football club. This cost me a nominal amount. It did not entitle me to membership of the Leagues Club (which was a seperate organisation). What it entitled me to was vote to elect the board and indeed to stand for the board. Ok that was a totally different structure to one in which we are involved with individual ownership rather than community ownership.

Is there any chance that Mike would consider allowing an elected member to sit on the advisory board. This I think would be a great way of involving the fans in the running of the club, but even more importantly allowing the fans to see they do have some input to the running of the club.
I am sure you realise reading this forum that the posters here are made up of 'The good, the bad and the ugly", but there are some very good football brains among them. Worth a thought.

Many years ago back in season one I was a fairly active (not as active as some) member of the Marinators. We were keen as mustard and wanted to be part of the club. The club kept us at arms length and were probably scared that we were a bunch of "Social hooligans". This hurt. They allowed us to help with the fan day (I spent all day on the barbecue) which was great. But when it came to the presentation night they allowed us only one table after much lobbying. Throughout the season we had been voting on our player of the year. At the presentation night we wanted to present this award with the others being presented. This was not allowed. We presented Kwassy with his trophy at the back of the auditorium at the end of the evening. This hurt more than anything else and made us feel like the least important part of the organisation, just to be humoured and tolerated. I personally have found it impossible to forgive the club for treating us like that.

I would like to see this fans trophy return. SFCU (a great forum) does one through their forum and I am sure Dibo or Adz could set up a similar voting system to what they have here. I would then like to see the trophy presented at the awards night by a representative of the fans and for that trophy to be seen as one of THE more desirable trophies presented at the night. I will happily contribute all or most (I am sure others here would like to be involved) of the cost of this trophy.

The take home message from all of the above is, that to be a member is to be involved in he organisation.

Once again, that you Shaun for listening to us.

 

[pjennings]

Hi Shaun,

Is there any chance that Mike would consider allowing an elected member to sit on the advisory board. This I think would be a great way of involving the fans in the running of the club, but even more importantly allowing the fans to see they do have some input to the running of the club.
I am sure you realise reading this forum that the posters here are made up of 'The good, the bad and the ugly", but there are some very good football brains among them. Worth a thought.

This is something that I was mulling over before I replied. I think 'advisory' is the apt word or 'observer' and think it is a great idea. I do not believe that the members under the current structure can reasonably expect voting rights on any board. However, properly done and representative enough, member input into issues could provide feedback to the club while they were considering issues, possibly avoiding negative backlashes. Not everyone is going to be happy with every decision, but representative feed back could prove invaluable.

 

[Manny_ccm]

Hi Shaun,
.....
Many years ago back in season one I was a fairly active (not as active as some) member of the Marinators. We were keen as mustard and wanted to be part of the club. The club kept us at arms length and were probably scared that we were a bunch of "Social hooligans". This hurt. They allowed us to help with the fan day (I spent all day on the barbecue) which was great. But when it came to the presentation night they allowed us only one table after much lobbying. Throughout the season we had been voting on our player of the year. At the presentation night we wanted to present this award with the others being presented. This was not allowed. We presented Kwassy with his trophy at the back of the auditorium at the end of the evening. This hurt more than anything else and made us feel like the least important part of the organisation, just to be humoured and tolerated. I personally have found it impossible to forgive the club for treating us like that.

I would like to see this fans trophy return. SFCU (a great forum) does one through their forum and I am sure Dibo or Adz could set up a similar voting system to what they have here. I would then like to see the trophy presented at the awards night by a representative of the fans and for that trophy to be seen as one of THE more desirable trophies presented at the night. I will happily contribute all or most (I am sure others here would like to be involved) of the cost of this trophy.

.....

I'm not Shaun but FWIW, this already happens through Central Coast Mariners Official Supporters Club http://www.ccmosc.com.au/about-us/player-of-the-year-voting
Monty won last year, and Reddy the year before from memory

I'm not sure the club/players need another fan sourced award to dilute the existing ones otherwise the FB Members page would no doubt want to get in on the action as well as any other splinter groups who deem themselves worthy of handing out awards

 

[Ancient Mariner]

I'm not Shaun but FWIW, this already happens through Central Coast Mariners Official Supporters Club http://www.ccmosc.com.au/about-us/player-of-the-year-voting
Monty won last year, and Reddy the year before from memory

I'm not sure the club/players need another fan sourced award to dilute the existing ones otherwise the FB Members page would no doubt want to get in on the action as well as any other splinter groups who deem themselves worthy of handing out awards

Shows how out of touch I have become. Fully agree, one award from the fans is enough.

Mind you the forum members are the only true supporters, you splitters.

 

[Atomic]

I'm not Shaun but FWIW, this already happens through Central Coast Mariners Official Supporters Club http://www.ccmosc.com.au/about-us/player-of-the-year-voting
Monty won last year, and Reddy the year before from memory

I'm not sure the club/players need another fan sourced award to dilute the existing ones otherwise the FB Members page would no doubt want to get in on the action as well as any other splinter groups who deem themselves worthy of handing out awards

Is voting open to the general public? I'm not a member of the CCMOSC.

 

[bikinigirl]

Shows how out of touch I have become. Fully agree, one award from the fans is enough.

Mind you the forum members are the only true supporters, you splitters.

. true supporters are members of both

 

[bikinigirl]

Is voting open to the general public? I'm not a member of the CCMOSC.

. no it is not open to the public for some of the same reasons that this whole topic is being discussed ... and the current system prevents multiple votes which avoids 'stacking'

. unfortunately membership cannot be free because of the costs involved in maintaining an independent incorporated body - the main cost being insurance

. in a similar fashion ... i think we can all be grateful that Adz is in a position to be able to keep this place running for us - long may it continue

 

[Wombat]

Hi Shaun,

Thank you for taking the time to talk to us on this forum, this I believe is the most important thing you can do to link the club to the fans that cannot be over stated. It is also greatly appreciated and is probably the most important thing to keep the hardcore fans committed through these tough times. Love the way you cope with Wombat, 'bout time he offered you free Thai massage.

Thoughts on membership (which is the point of this thread).

As has been mentioned before there is a difference between buying a season ticket and becoming a member of an organisation.

In a previous life I was a member of a Rugby League football club. This cost me a nominal amount. It did not entitle me to membership of the Leagues Club (which was a seperate organisation). What it entitled me to was vote to elect the board and indeed to stand for the board. Ok that was a totally different structure to one in which we are involved with individual ownership rather than community ownership.

Is there any chance that Mike would consider allowing an elected member to sit on the advisory board. This I think would be a great way of involving the fans in the running of the club, but even more importantly allowing the fans to see they do have some input to the running of the club.
I am sure you realise reading this forum that the posters here are made up of 'The good, the bad and the ugly", but there are some very good football brains among them. Worth a thought.

Many years ago back in season one I was a fairly active (not as active as some) member of the Marinators. We were keen as mustard and wanted to be part of the club. The club kept us at arms length and were probably scared that we were a bunch of "Social hooligans". This hurt. They allowed us to help with the fan day (I spent all day on the barbecue) which was great. But when it came to the presentation night they allowed us only one table after much lobbying. Throughout the season we had been voting on our player of the year. At the presentation night we wanted to present this award with the others being presented. This was not allowed. We presented Kwassy with his trophy at the back of the auditorium at the end of the evening. This hurt more than anything else and made us feel like the least important part of the organisation, just to be humoured and tolerated. I personally have found it impossible to forgive the club for treating us like that.

I would like to see this fans trophy return. SFCU (a great forum) does one through their forum and I am sure Dibo or Adz could set up a similar voting system to what they have here. I would then like to see the trophy presented at the awards night by a representative of the fans and for that trophy to be seen as one of THE more desirable trophies presented at the night. I will happily contribute all or most (I am sure others here would like to be involved) of the cost of this trophy.

The take home message from all of the above is, that to be a member is to be involved in he organisation.

Once again, that you Shaun for listening to us.

Why does Shaun deserve a free massage? I think my business partner in my printing business has given them plenty of freebies and free advice.
Shaun knows I have a lot of respect for him and I have not been shy to praise him and Dan wherever possible....simply because they deserve it.
I would be happy to give a 1 hour free massage voucher to the fans player of the year.....(after the players gave it to Rosebud not Monty last year they can't be trusted) if the people involved would like that.

 

[ballantyne]

I agree with others here who have said that we are not members in the full sense of the word. I've been a member most years, but to me it's a season ticket primarily. It also means that if I can't get to a game for some reason, I'm not too bothered; the club got paid, I didn't lose too much, I can transfer it to someone else.
The "membership pack" is just laughable to me. It's daggy old tat, paid for by sponsors, a waste of resources. I don't want it. Bring-a-friend vouchers to me are sort of nice, but if a match is that attractive to casual supporters, they should pay full for the experience, and they've got to go to the ticket window anyway.
However priority on finals tix is very valuable to me, not quite a deal breaker but very important.
This year, the inclusion of Newcastle games was a masterstroke. It made me far more likely to travel there, and when I did, the atmosphere was best ever.
So in summary, being a member to me is about enhancing my football spectating experience. Anything that does that is welcome. If I wanted a say on the board, as a member of the club , I would go about it a different way.

 

[Big Al]

I've enjoyed being a member and haven't been in previous sports I've been a fan of.

I don't care about the terminology, it is what it is just like a gym membership. For me it's just a right to use the facilities, in this case my preferred seat. Member just sounds a lot more warm and fuzzy than a season ticket holder.

I love the stuff that comes with the membership, I love wearing my hat around town and seeing others doing the same, I will and have been approached by total strangers just to say did you see the game or going to the game just because the hat says to me your interested. Just brings a sense of community (although was wearing it yesterday and wife was driving and Liam Rose was strolling across the road and my misses didn't slow down and he gave some stink eye with a little bit of, but your wearing a members hat confusion - simple mate get off the road when my wife is driving, no matter what)

I think the club does a great job and I remember filling out that survey and I think Dan deserves the recognition, he's done a great job especially when the pitch performances have made his job difficult.

I asked for some help during the season with the free tickets and he was right on it and helped us out, this was purely something we received for being members and I appreciate that. I felt Dan was approachable and I could ask him anything as well as just say hi.

I used to follow NBL in Sydney when I lived there and was never a member but would attend 4 or 5 games a season and all finals games. I used to get jealous that all giveaways etc always went to the members, I was like we are paying fans as well, but understood there financial commitment and dedication. Finals could sometimes be very hard to get tickets to so that was a nervous time as a fan. I appreciate this as part of our membership and believe the FFA system works here and is advantageous for members. I would be absolutely pissed off if I didn't get a finals ticket to a casual fan, so this is probably the biggest benefit.

I didn't attend the Newcastle games in Newcastle due to other commitments but it is something that certainly made me what to go to a place others had made sound like a hell hole not worth worrying about. I think it was a great initiative, however I would of been happy paying $10 just to put a little money into there kitty and hence ours on there return here. That is a price where I go bargain and isn't off putting.

I have read on other forums that prices are getting out of hand for away fans. I believe this is effecting our support as well as the support coming to CCS. If we can get them in then we can get them to spend on the coast and in the stadium (not that we care ATM).
I would like to see the Newcastle idea expanded to an away membership or something similar for NSW. The prices for away games are now $30+ minimum per game. If we had $20 tickets it makes it accessible as you got to get there and eat and usually take a partner. At two tickets for $60 before I've even got dressed Plus ticketek fees your up to $65-$70 before a few drinks etc. That's just to expensive for me, especially when what gold membership equates to about $20 a game. So I might have to pick which game or not go at all.

I heard a WSW fan say because of the stupid draw setup, WSW where away to all 3 NSW clubs every second year and was way to expensive to attend all those games. I think we had the same problem this year. So the FFA need to even that our for our home attendances as well as for travelling fans.

We could restrict $20 to limited number as SFC and WSW have so many members but even if you say gave 500 $20 tickets then they would be saying to there mates you coming to the game I am and they might pay full price. Also might be available a week in advance or something so you can say 500 are coming going to be a good crowd. People will go to matches if they think everyone else is going as don't want to miss out on the atmosphere.

One of the problems I wonder about in attracting more members is there access to Foxtel. I'd like to know what the membership to Foxtel ratio is. Do Foxtel customers feel more inclined to be members because they can watch all the away games as well as replays and that meats there passion for the team or do they stay at home and not go to games at all?
I remember the guy at the forum who was frustrated as he did not have Foxtel and was basically looking for an avenue to watch his team where he couldn't afford Foxtel. He could go to the pub but that doesn't suit a lot of people.
Could we be losing potential members because they don't feel connected to the teams games due to lack of visibility. We are on free to air like once a year.

I have an idea that maybe we could setup a Mariners TV (yes copy of EPL clubs) so that we can have game highlights available to non Foxtel fans. We could even try selling it to NBN TV over the summer or could run it through the member Facebook page. Maybe a replay or some sort of highlight show on Sunday arvo on NBN TV, the slot they have NRL on in the winter. Maybe the new digital rights can somehow be linked to our fans and membership. Get the FFA to make it cheaper to access the digital content if they are members, much like telephone companies offer to there customers.

All in all I don't care much about pushing the word member, but maybe that's because we are, although I'd have no problem with it if I wasn't.

 

[Timmah]

Solid post Al, I rate it. Regarding away tickets, it seems as though most clubs have been gouging in that department sadly... and it's counter intuitive, IMO

 

[Big Al]

Solid post Al, I rate it. Regarding away tickets, it seems as though most clubs have been gouging in that department sadly... and it's counter intuitive, IMO

Massive gouging, I know all things go up but the game thrives on fans, especially us we rely heavily on away crowds from the Sydney teams.

I also read a WSW fan complain about our prices being so high but was answered with, we charged them more. Also if you come to CCS you can't buy a bad seat but Spotless looked like a hole, the photos from where our fans were located was horrible. There was no way I was paying +$30 to sit there.